Hope for Vegans in Jesus

Huckleberry

Novice
Joined
Jan 8, 2021
Reaction score
2
Age
37
Location
NJ
Lifestyle
  1. Vegan
LOL. Government own everything by definition (consider Eminent domain) and it's pretty clear that I was talking about private organizations to begin with. I see you did not comment of the fact that Church is an ultra-rich business and that business' primary source of income is donations. Odd.


Unlike the organized religions, Bezos adds tangible value to the economy and pays a lot of taxes. He is not exploiting peoples insecurities to extort fees "for the next world".

It's not any different from your approach early in the where you are spraying us with youtube videos about math while knowing little about the subject. In any case, regardless of how my sources are found (google, of course), they are sources that have been well researched and unbiased. So far you have not made any real attempts to refute them with similar quality sources.


Bible explicitly says that he ate fish himself and cooked fish for his disciples. But when it's convenient for recruitment purposes, suddenly it's all metaphysics and not literal. LOL.

On this thread first people supported Weinstein and now Bezos. Bizarre. Bezos is deft at exploiting:



And many Christians help out those in need in this world. You must be aware this is a primary duty for Christians.

I’m not sure that quoting Wikipedia a couple times qualifies you as a crack researcher.

Maybe we can agree that you are best at pretending to be knowledgeable, like when you copy pasted a big block of text and pretended it was your own work. Remember Post #27 in this thread? You really ought to apologize for that sort of thing. Lol
 
Last edited:

Huckleberry

Novice
Joined
Jan 8, 2021
Reaction score
2
Age
37
Location
NJ
Lifestyle
  1. Vegan
Do the old words stop describing old things once we invent new words to describe new things? However, very accurate measurements of the precession of the planet Mercury necessitated an overhaul of Newton's theory of gravity in the form of Einstein's general relativity.

The whole "math is invented vs discovered" argument is centuries old and it it's far from binary. Many prominent mathematicians and physicists (Einstein, Hilbert and Cantor, to name a few) thought that math an invented set of tools and it seems that most practitioners hold similar beliefs. The reality is that mathematics is probably both invented and discovered, in a very weird way. First, we invent mathematical concepts by way of abstracting elements from the world around us. We come up with conceptualizations about shapes, lines, sets, groups, and so forth, either for some specific purpose or simply for fun. They then go on to discover the connections among those concepts. This iteration of invention and discovery is man-made, so our mathematical concepts are ultimately based on our perceptions and the mental pictures we can conjure. One would imagine, for example, should we live in a perfectly continuous world would not have invented natural numbers early on but instead relied on some sort of continuous mathematics for daily use.

When a tennis ball machine shoots out balls, you can use the natural numbers 1, 2, 3, and so on, to describe the flux of balls. When firefighters use a hose, however, they must invoke other concepts, such as volume or weight, to render a meaningful description of the stream. So, too, when distinct subatomic particles collide in a particle accelerator, physicists turn to measures such as energy and momentum and not to the end number of particles, which would reveal only partial information about how the original particles collided because additional particles can be created in the process.
It's evolutionary, too - over time only the best models survive. Failed models, (like Descartes vortices of cosmic matter) die in their infancy or get disproven later. In contrast, successful models evolve as new information becomes available and stick around - the area of a circle is as true today as it was two centuries before.

Whats incredible is that mathematicians sometimes develop entire fields of study with no practical application in mind, and yet decades, even centuries, later physicists discover that these very branches make sense of their observations. Galois, for example, developed group theory in the early 1800s for the sole purpose of determining the solvability of polynomial equations. The general idea is that groups are algebraic structures made up of sets of objects (say, the integers) united under some operation (for instance, addition) that obey specific rules (among them the existence of an identity element such as 0, which, when added to any integer, gives back that same integer). In 20th-century physics, this rather abstract field turned out to be the most fruitful way of categorizing elementary particles. There are plenty of other examples like that, topology and number theory to name the few.

Anyway, while it's fun to discuss mathematics and it's origins, I can't imagine someone believing or not believing in God because of the effectiveness of mathematics. What belief really boils down to is an emotional choice which is made relatively early on in life. Every argument is usually a justification of that choice. Some people are distrustful of anything they have not seen and they turn out like me. Some people turn out like you. This said, if being religious makes you more likely to make ethical choices, I am all for you being religious.
 
Joined
Feb 2, 2020
Reaction score
57
Age
48
Location
New York
Lifestyle
  1. Vegan newbie
I’m not sure that quoting Wikipedia a couple times qualifies you as a crack researcher.
It's a consensus source. Unlike the unilateral garbage you are quoting most of the time.

In any case, I am done with this argument, welcome to my ignore list. You are the first one there, so it's an honor. To be honest, I am not even sure you are vegan or just using this forum as a convenient platform for evangelizing.
 

beancounter

The Fire That Burns Within
Joined
Jun 3, 2012
Reaction score
2,502
Location
In the Church of the Poisoned Mind
And many Christians help out those in need in this world. You must be aware this is a primary duty for Christians.

Not as much as you think:

"Before you jump to conclusions that religion and generosity were somehow connected, keep in mind that those numbers included giving “both to religious and to secular groups”… In other words, church counted as charity.

But when you excluded donations given to churches and religious groups, the map changed dramatically, giving an edge to the least religious states in the country:"

Earlier this week, a new report released by the National Study of American Religious Giving put a rest to that myth that religious people are more charitable than the non-religious. It turns out nearly 75% of charitable giving by all Americans… benefits places of worship and faith-based charities. A lot of the money isn’t helping the poor and less fortunate. It’s going to the church."

Jay Michaelson of Religious Dispatches explains:

… The study found that 65% of religiously-affiliated people donate to congregations or charitable organizations. (More on that statistic later.) 80% of Americans are religiously affiliated. And 65% of 80% is just about… 55% of the total. In other words, the religious people who are giving say they’re giving because of religion. And they’re overwhelmingly giving to religion as well.

Probably the most notable statistics, though, are those which compare religious and non-religious philanthropy. Religion is supposed to make us better people, which includes, I assume, being more generous. So, is it the case that religious people give more generously than the non-religious?
Well, yes and no. Remember that statistic, that 65% of religious people donate to charity? The non-religious figure is 56%. But according to the study, the entire 9% difference is attributed to religious giving to congregations and religious organizations. So, yes, religion causes people to give more — to religion itself.
"A lot of religious giving, then, is self-serving, in the guise of helping others. Often, the donations benefit their faith.

It’s not like there aren’t secular alternatives to religious charities. There’s no shortage of secular groups that feed the hungry and house the poor and fight for the under-privileged. But religious people aren’t giving to those groups as much as they’re giving to groups that do good while also proselytizing. (Which means some of that money being donated is going toward spreading the faith, not actually helping other people.)"
 

Dougrus

Devotee
Joined
Jan 7, 2020
Reaction score
221
Age
47
Location
Rocky Hill, CT
Lifestyle
  1. Vegan
Wow, I thought vegans were open-minded and tolerant! If someone wants to discuss their religion let’s not talk about deleting their views. If you are not interested in the topic I have a solution: find another thread with a topic that does interest you.

Regarding pets and Heaven: Do Dogs Go to Heaven? A Christian Perspective
Your link provides no proof that the bible indicates that any pet will make it to heaven. Only opinions of people on the matter. If you can provide me with any biblical quotes that indicate that animal souls will be/can be saved, please provide.

C.S Lewis was an apologist. Which means he specifically searched for ways to rectify some of the "uncomfortable beliefs" that fundamental Christian doctrines implied. This article provided no biblical evidence of animals going to heaven at all. Only speculations.

I am open minded and tolerant. But, someone coming on to a forum and very extensively and fervently trying to spread ideas that are completely unrelated to the topic at hand, is not appropriate. I dont care if people believe in religious ideologies (as I am sure many people on this forum are Christians'), but don't flood a forum with it when it has no relevance to what people are here for. He wasn't just stating his religious beliefs, he was writing paragraph after paragraph and post after post of religious evangelism. People come here to discuss vegan diet. Not religion. Of course if it came up in conversation and was discussed that is one thing...But this guy specifically came on the forum to evangelize. I looked at his other posts and could find no incidences of him being here for the actual purpose of discussing veganism. Only the purpose of spreading Christian ideals. If I came on a Christian forum and started writing paragraph after paragraph/post after post about the unethical nature of Christ because he ate meat how long do you think it would take for me to get banned there? Not a true parallel but think about it. Our local town Facebook regularly deletes forum posts that are expressly political and religious. Why? Because those are things that people should keep out of places of other purpose as they cloud things heavily.

The only thing that I expect to be imposed on me here is living a vegan lifestyle. Because that is what the forum is for. Veganforum.org. If I want lectures on Christianity, Im sure I could easily find a place for that.
 

Huckleberry

Novice
Joined
Jan 8, 2021
Reaction score
2
Age
37
Location
NJ
Lifestyle
  1. Vegan
Your link provides no proof that the bible indicates that any pet will make it to heaven. Only opinions of people on the matter. If you can provide me with any biblical quotes that indicate that animal souls will be/can be saved, please provide.

C.S Lewis was an apologist. Which means he specifically searched for ways to rectify some of the "uncomfortable beliefs" that fundamental Christian doctrines implied. This article provided no biblical evidence of animals going to heaven at all. Only speculations.

I am open minded and tolerant. But, someone coming on to a forum and very extensively and fervently trying to spread ideas that are completely unrelated to the topic at hand, is not appropriate. I dont care if people believe in religious ideologies (as I am sure many people on this forum are Christians'), but don't flood a forum with it when it has no relevance to what people are here for. He wasn't just stating his religious beliefs, he was writing paragraph after paragraph and post after post of religious evangelism. People come here to discuss vegan diet. Not religion. Of course if it came up in conversation and was discussed that is one thing...But this guy specifically came on the forum to evangelize. I looked at his other posts and could find no incidences of him being here for the actual purpose of discussing veganism. Only the purpose of spreading Christian ideals. If I came on a Christian forum and started writing paragraph after paragraph/post after post about the unethical nature of Christ because he ate meat how long do you think it would take for me to get banned there? Not a true parallel but think about it. Our local town Facebook regularly deletes forum posts that are expressly political and religious. Why? Because those are things that people should keep out of places of other purpose as they cloud things heavily.

The only thing that I expect to be imposed on me here is living a vegan lifestyle. Because that is what the forum is for. Veganforum.org. If I want lectures on Christianity, Im sure I could easily find a place for that.
You seem to feel that the existence of an animal-free Heaven is a core Christian doctrine. Why do you feel that way? The website I linked to quotes a number of Bible verses and some prominent Christians.

I am sure most Christians forums would welcome people who want to talk about veganism. You talk about a “fervent” poster “flooding” the forum. You are exaggerating wildly. If you don’t want to interact with this poster put him on ignore. What’s the problem? Don’t you believe in freedom of speech?
 

Huckleberry

Novice
Joined
Jan 8, 2021
Reaction score
2
Age
37
Location
NJ
Lifestyle
  1. Vegan
Do atheists indoctrinate? Why do you avoid my question?

Do you admit your earlier criticism of Prof. Hawley was silly?

I don’t know what you’re trying to prove with that ugly bigoted little video. Some atheists certainly seem to be preoccupied with and terrified by Veggie Tales. Lol

Can you acknowledge that atheists discriminate against and persecute religious folk?


The corporate media: Christians Continue to Be Undermined by Mainstream Media


Intolerance: J. K. Rowling Speaks Out against ‘Climate of Fear’ | National Review

Please stop denying discrimination and persecution!

Regarding donations to charity: Religious people more likely to give to charity, study shows
 
Last edited:

rogerjolly

Practitioner
Joined
Aug 12, 2017
Reaction score
429
Age
77
Location
Yorkshire
Lifestyle
  1. Vegan
I have a ditty that I cannot get out of my head. The lyrics are by the late Alex Glasgow. They came back to me because of the silliness going on in this thread. Please attempt to sing it.

My dad
My dad is better than your dad
My dad is better than your dad
My dad

My dad
My dad’s got hairs on his chest
My dad’s got holes in his vest
My dad

The words in my head have become:
My lot
My lot is better than your lot
My lot is better than your lot
My lot

Do atheists indoctrinate?
I am convinced that some do. And some do not.
Ditto Christians. Ditto Vegans. Ditto ………


Can you acknowledge that atheists discriminate against ......
I am convinced that some do. And some do not.
Ditto Christians. Ditto Vegans. Ditto ………


Regarding donations to charity ....
I am convinced that some atheists give generously. And some do not. And some tell the world about it. And some do not.
Ditto Christians. Ditto Vegans. Ditto ………


Here is my most recent religion joke. It was donated to me by a cyber friend from this forum and is very relevant here:
Whenever a Christian questions my atheism I reply, “The only difference between you and me is that I have one god fewer than you have.”

Roger.
 
Last edited:
  • Agree
Reactions: silva

1956

Practitioner
Joined
Dec 1, 2020
Reaction score
564
Age
64
Location
Ireland
Lifestyle
  1. Vegan
This thread has gone So far off track from the original post...
It feels sad to me to see such division. I have not posted on this thread before because I can see both points of view and I don’t really hold one belief or the other. What I would call myself is Spiritual rather than religious and I am not an atheist.
Personally I liked the original post and I feel that the Animals can use all of the support that they can get and if that support comes from a Christian movement that’s fine. Being Vegan is what matters to me. And we can use All of the Vegans possible!
The majority of the posts from both sides seem very similar to the the arguments between meat eaters and Vegans - one side is right and the other wrong. However, in the meat /vs Vegan there is a reason for Vegan being right because it is a question of morality not personal opinion or beliefs.
Neither side in this discussion is right or wrong and I understand that you care deeply about your views. What I care about most deeply is the Animals and being Vegan is how I support them.
Could we All possibly not argue and support the Animals?
 
  • Agree
  • Like
Reactions: silva and Brian W

Brian W

Mad Bard
Joined
Jun 15, 2018
Reaction score
2,399
Location
.
Lifestyle
  1. Other
Yeah, I said my piece then stepped out because there was too much tension and I was beginning to feel stressed about it too. I much prefer a one to one with somebody who is genuinely curious.
 
  • Like
  • Agree
Reactions: 1956 and silva

silva

Master
Supporter
Joined
Jun 3, 2012
Reaction score
11,657
Location
USA
I'm also sad this thread became such a joke, I believe the OP was genuine, but one of few.
I thought of starting a thread on agnostics, as we certainly have our issues, but didn't really feel it belongs in a vegan thread, as this did not.
People that don't have religion aren't a cult. they don't have shared traits so it's pretty silly to blame their non belief on their behavior
With religion you're always right because you make it whatever you want!
Personally I have a far harder time with people accepting that I have no belief than I've ever had a vegan, with more attempts to convert me.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1956

Huckleberry

Novice
Joined
Jan 8, 2021
Reaction score
2
Age
37
Location
NJ
Lifestyle
  1. Vegan
I have a ditty that I cannot get out of my head. The lyrics are by the late Alex Glasgow. They came back to me because of the silliness going on in this thread. Please attempt to sing it.

My dad
My dad is better than your dad
My dad is better than your dad
My dad

My dad
My dad’s got hairs on his chest
My dad’s got holes in his vest
My dad

The words in my head have become:
My lot
My lot is better than your lot
My lot is better than your lot
My lot


I am convinced that some do. And some do not.
Ditto Christians. Ditto Vegans. Ditto ………



I am convinced that some do. And some do not.
Ditto Christians. Ditto Vegans. Ditto ………



I am convinced that some atheists give generously. And some do not. And some tell the world about it. And some do not.
Ditto Christians. Ditto Vegans. Ditto ………


Here is my most recent religion joke. It was donated to me by a cyber friend from this forum and is very relevant here:
Whenever a Christian questions my atheism I reply, “The only difference between you and me is that I have one god fewer than you have.”

Roger.
Weren’t you one of the first people on this thread to make dubious assertions regarding the superiority of your belief system?

Should we conclude you are a hypocrite?
 
Last edited:

1956

Practitioner
Joined
Dec 1, 2020
Reaction score
564
Age
64
Location
Ireland
Lifestyle
  1. Vegan
So all points-of-view are equal and we shouldn’t have opinions?

Some people might consider that proposition unoriginal or lazy or self-defeating.

I guess some people prefer pleasantries and tea parties while others enjoy vigorous debate. To each his own.
In my eyes what was going on in this thread was Not debate.
It was - I believe this - I’m right
Then - well I believe this- I’m right
And on, and on
When there isn’t A right or A wrong - there are opinion and beliefs...
To me it sounded nasty and did not reflect well on either side...
At least that’s how I view this....
 
Last edited:

Huckleberry

Novice
Joined
Jan 8, 2021
Reaction score
2
Age
37
Location
NJ
Lifestyle
  1. Vegan
In my eyes what was going on in this thread was Not debate.
It was - I believe this - I’m right
Then - well I believe this- I’m right
And on, and on
When there isn’t A right or A wrong - there are opinion and beliefs...
To me it sounded nasty and did not reflect well on either side...
At least that’s how I view this....
I disagree. BOTH sides gave reasons why they considered themselves correct.

There isn’t a right or wrong? Are you sure you’re right about that?

If you don’t like vigorous debate you needn’t join in, you can just go to another thread. On this forum some like to debate, some seek information, some want a (virtual) hug. Let’s not condemn any of these groups.
 

1956

Practitioner
Joined
Dec 1, 2020
Reaction score
564
Age
64
Location
Ireland
Lifestyle
  1. Vegan
I disagree. BOTH sides gave reasons why they considered themselves correct.

There isn’t a right or wrong? Are you sure you’re right about that?

If you don’t like vigorous debate you needn’t join in, you can just go to another thread. On this forum some like to debate, some seek information, some want a (virtual) hug. Let’s not condemn any of these groups.
The reason that I said that there is no right or wrong is that ‘you‘ cannot prove that there is a God and ’they’ cannot prove that there isn’t.
Peace...
Although I don’t think that that is what you are looking for...
 
  • Agree
Reactions: silva

Huckleberry

Novice
Joined
Jan 8, 2021
Reaction score
2
Age
37
Location
NJ
Lifestyle
  1. Vegan

spirit2change

Novice
Joined
May 24, 2020
Reaction score
6
Location
Glendale, California, USA
Lifestyle
  1. Vegan
Today we will be studying the topic, does God resurrect animals? Many vegans and non vegans are wondering about this question. Will we ever see our pets again? We will build upon the foundation formed from our previous studies, so if you have not read my previous posts please read them as each helps to explain biblical concepts which we will use to answer our present question. As we study let us pray to God that he may give us wisdom and understanding and faith, because the understanding that we may gain from studying the bible is a blessing that comes from God's spirit through his grace and love towards us. My hope is that you also endure in studying and faith notwithstanding the trials that it may bring.

Please read John 20:24-30.

Thomas was a disciple, a follower of Jesus. He knew Jesus personally and had spent many hours with him. After Jesus died and was raised back to life, other disciples besides Thomas saw him. These disciples told Thomas that they had seen Jesus alive again, but Thomas said he would not believe Jesus was alive unless he touched him. Jesus later visited Thomas and asked Thomas to touch him, even the wounds he received while on the cross, as described by verse 27. Jesus had these scars marking his body but was in perfect health despite them. After touching Jesus, Thomas finally believed that he was risen from the dead. The same man he knew died and was now back alive again.

Just as the disciples touched Jesus even after he was resurrected, we have a desire for our pets to be resurrected so they may enjoy life again and we may be with them again and touch them. Just as Jesus and Thomas continued the relationship they had before Jesus died, we would like our pets and ourselves to continue our relationship for eternity. Although unlike Jesus who was raised with scars, ones raised by Jesus normally do not have any scars or marks on their bodies once they are raised. Jesus is unique in this regard. His scars serve as a reminder to all that he suffered to save us from our sins and that our life is in him.

Please read John 6:40.

Note the words "I will raise him up at the last day." This is Jesus speaking. He tells us that he has the ability to raise people back to life. When they are raised back to life they have bodies and are solid and may be touched, just like how Jesus was solid and real after he was raised to life by God the Father. The bible clearly shows us that Jesus may raise people back to life, but will he also raise animals back to life in this same way?

We learned in our previous studies that all of the animals are the work of the creator's hand. It was Christ who made the bird singing from the branch, and the squirrels playing on the tree. How does God feel towards the animals he made?

Please read Psalm 145:8-10.

This Psalm speaks of God's "works" which include all of the animals which he worked to create. So these verses tell us that God is full of compassion and gives tender mercies over all his works which include the fish of the sea, the birds of the air and the cats and dogs and horses that live among us. God is good to all, full of compassion and loves the animals and people he made.

Please read Romans 5:12.

In our previous studies we learned that God originally created a world with no death nor suffering in it. In God's unfallen creation, animals would have been completely happy and would have enjoyed eternal life along with mankind. This was God's desire. But Satan rebelled against God and then tempted people to sin, or break God's law of love. When people broke God's law, death and suffering was the result. This verse tells us that death entered the world through one man, through Adam's sin in the beginning. The world then fell into disorder.

We will be studying about a place called the "new earth".

Please read Matthew 5:5.

Please read 2 Peter 3:13.

Please read Revelation 21:1.

Jesus tells us the meek shall inherit the earth, meaning this very planet we are standing on. Jesus disciples Peter and John also looked forward to a place called the new earth. People commonly use the word "heaven" to refer to a sort of perfect place. The bible teaches us that God intends our final home to be on the earth but only after it is cleansed, freed from the corruption of sin and made new. This new earth will be created after Jesus returns. People of faith have been hoping for the new earth ever since Adam and Eve sinned and the earth fell into corruption.

Please read Romans 8:18-23.

These verses from Romans 8 help us understand why animals suffer and die. Let us first note that verse 18 tells us that the sufferings of our present time are not comparable to the glory and goodness of the new earth which God will soon create after the return of Jesus. Once we are in the new earth, any pain we went through will be forgotten because it will look so small compared with the glory surrounding us. This idea of a person in heaven or the the new earth trying to remember their sorrows from before has been described as follows:

We tried to call up our greatest trials, but they looked so small compared with the far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory that surrounded us, that we could not speak them out, and we all cried out, "Alleluia! heaven is cheap enough!" and we touched our glorious harps and made heaven's arches ring. Hvn 82.3

The next verses Romans 8:19-22 tell us that the "creature" meaning created things including animals were subjected to pain and suffering in order to obtain the hope of the new earth which will be free from sin. Sin causes pain, and is of the devil. God never intended for sin nor pain to exist. Overcoming sin involves enduring through pain and trials as may be witnessed in the life, sufferings and death of Christ. In the life of Christ, sin is shown to be exceedingly sinful as we understand the cross on which Jesus died.

Romans 8:21-22 describe the earth and animals as being in the bondage of corruption and groaning, waiting to be set free from corruption when the new earth arrives. The current time is as if the world is still being born. Like a woman laboring as a child is delivered, the pain lasts for a time but is endured because of the hope of having the child. Animals die because the whole creation is suffering from sin.

Romans 8:23 expresses how we believers also suffer as we wait in hope for the abolition of sin. We wait in sure hope of that day when we will be given new incorruptible bodies to live in the new earth.

Please read Isaiah 11:1-10.

The prophet Isaiah lived about the year 700 B.C. and his inspired writings tell us about the new earth. Isaiah 11:1 tells us of a "rod out of the stem of Jesse" using the imagery of a branch growing out of a root. Jesse is the father of the famous King David, and they are both grandfathers of Jesus as may be read in the family tree beginning at Luke 3:23. So when Isaiah tells us about the "rod out of the stem of Jesse" he is telling about Jesus who grew out of Jesse and David. Verse 10, written about 700 years before Jesus was born, foretold that the Gentiles (meaning non-Jews) would seek this rod that stood up from the root of Jesse. This prophecy was fulfilled because after Jesus was born on earth, the Gentiles from all nations and not only the Jews came to Jesus. People from all over the world believe in Jesus today, and the hope of the new earth is available to people from any country.

Isaiah 11:4 tells us how Jesus will return to earth again to end sin and create the new earth full of peace. This verse also describes the meek of the earth similar to how Jesus said "Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth." as we read above in Matthew 5:5.

Animals appear abundantly in Isaiah 11:6-9 as the prophet gives us a description of the new earth. The wolf dwells with the lamb, leopards and baby goats lay down in the grass together, and children lead lions. In the new earth animals are no longer seeking to eat one another but they are friends.

Please read Genesis 1:30.

The new earth is a recreation of the earth before sin existed. This verse from Genesis tells us God originally created animals to eat plants, and Isaiah 11:7 reflects this by telling us that in the new earth lions will eat grass like oxen. The new earth is a wonderful world to come where "They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain" (Isaiah 11:9).

We now know that the new earth will be full of animals. But will these be animals that God has resurrected such as our pets? To find an answer we may reason from the scriptures. We will read about several principles in the bible then come to a conclusion based on them.

In our previous posts we learned how love requires free will and it cannot be "programmed". We also saw how animals are able to love. Since animals are able to love, and love requires free will, we may conclude that animals have free will. We also learned that free will means there is a risk of sin. Since animals have free will, we may also also conclude that it is possible for animals to sin. We saw that angels may sin when we studied about the rebellion of Lucifer, and we saw that humans may sin when we studied the 10 commandments, and likewise we are now concluding that animals may sin also. And this is an important piece of knowledge in answering our question, "does God resurrect animals?"

Please read Hebrews 9:27.

This verse from Hebrews tells us "it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment". We learned in a previous post how God's 10 commandment law convicts us all of sin, and we may freely come to Jesus for grace and forgiveness of sins. So our lifetime may be seen as a test. While we are alive, do we choose to leave our sinful ways and be reconciled with God, or do we love a sinful way of living and choose to continue in rebellion? God desires all to be reconciled back to him through repentance and mercy during our lifetimes. Then after our testing time is up, after death, God will judge based on the choices we made whether some would continue in rebellion and sin. This is the judgement spoken of in this verse from Hebrews.

Please read Nahum 1:9.

The prophet Nahum here describes the day when God puts an end to evil, similar to what we read from the prophet Isaiah. In this verse we are told that "affliction shall not rise up the second time." This means that after God puts an end to sin and creates the new earth, sin, rebellion and strife will never arise again. The universe will be peaceful forever in harmony with God.

And now we may reach a conclusion of our reasoning. Since sin will never arise again in the new earth, we may reason that God will fill the new earth with people and animals that have already been tested and proved faithful during their lives on the old earth. To create completely new people or animals in the new earth would be to risk sin all over again. So we reason that in the new earth instead of creating completely new animals, God will resurrect animals that already lived and died in the old earth. These are the ones that have been tested and proved faithful.

In Psalm 104 we may also read a description of God resurrecting animals to fill the new earth.

Please read Psalm 104:24-31.

This psalm describes many animals in earlier verses. Then verses 25-26 tell us about "small and great beasts" within the sea such as fish, whales, dolphins, sea lions, and otters. Verse 29 describes the breath of life leaving animals as they die. Then verse 30 tells us God sends forth his spirit, the breath of life, and the animals are created again to renew the face of the earth.

Especially if you knew or know a pet that you love, then please pray with me that God will soon reunite people with pets in the new earth.

Please read Psalms 84:9-12.

A single day in the new earth will be better than a thousand days here in the fallen earth.

Lord, please help us continue in faith. Thank you for your grace, God of heaven!

Dear reader, thank you for studying with me. I hope you and your loved ones are blessed.

With love,

Josef
 

StrangeOtter

Senior
Joined
Jun 20, 2018
Reaction score
1,071
Lifestyle
  1. Vegan
Söpös spirit seems to know what they are doing, so I don't think I have to pray for them.
We don't have to be reunited, all that matters is that she has found peace and is free from suffering.
My selfish wants should not be interfered with her going and comings.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Apr 5, 2021
Reaction score
24
Age
35
Location
Seattle
Lifestyle
  1. Vegan
I like the church because at the end of the day, boots on the ground it is churches running the homeless shelters, the food banks, the food pantries, the meals, showers for the homeless, laundry for the homeless, the food rescuing programs, the clothing handouts, etc. Atheists love to pretend to take the moral high ground, but they aren't preparing meals every day in every city and town in the USA. They aren't handing out toothbrushes, razors, and tampons. They don't want to get their hands dirty. They don't want to actually stand directly in front of poverty and try to give simple understanding gesture and help other than maybe giving a beggar $2.