Hope for Vegans in Jesus

[Urban Gardener]

While we’re at it, I’ve seen some posts from atheists with the same mentality, asserting that anyone who isn’t an atheist is less intelligent or delusional.

I’m sure we can discuss religion and learn from each other while respecting each other’s beliefs. We have the compassion within ourselves; we’re vegans.

And is Harvey Weinstein really a good example of anything? There must be other examples that don’t involve convicted serial rapists.

 

[beancounter]

I follow the teaching of the only true gods - FSM, IPU and of course the celestial teapot.

 

[VeganAnon]

.
Not OK on this forum: Shunning people who are vegan but eat honey.

Also not OK on this forum: Shunning people who don't follow Jesus.
.

Why? Is this a Christian forum? If so, please let me now so I can leave now. . If talking about a belief and not actively attacking people....cause shunned people that don't follow Jesus...Again I say leave a thread for the religious unless you want to dictate what we all say and think.

 

[beancounter]

Why? Is this a Christian forum? If so, please let me now so I can leave now. . If talking about a belief and not actively attacking people....cause shunned people that don't follow Jesus...Again I say leave a thread for the religious unless you want to dictate what we all say and think.

You can say whatever you want as long as it doesn't violate the TOS. Have you read it?

 

[David3]

Why? Is this a Christian forum? If so, please let me now so I can leave now. . If talking about a belief and not actively attacking people....cause shunned people that don't follow Jesus...Again I say leave a thread for the religious unless you want to dictate what we all say and think.

.
Spirit2Change made this statement in his post:

"The scribes and Pharisees together were a majority religious group in Israel which claimed to be following the God of the bible however this same majority group rejected Jesus the Son of God and thus revealed they were not truly following God."
..............................


This statement claims that people who don't believe that Jesus is only path to God are not following God, and therefore will not be saved. This would include Muslims, who see Mohammad as the prophet of God, and Jews, who see Moses as the prophet of God. It's simply not OK for people to make such claims on this forum.

If people want to praise Jesus and discuss his good works/teachings, that's great. I'm all for it. However, I don't think that we should allow people to claim that certain groups of people won't be saved/enlightened. It demeans their entire culture.
.

 

[beancounter]

 

[David3]

View attachment 23587

.
Now it's getting plain ridiculous. I'm sure that Jesus was a careful shopper, but this cartoon's skin color, facial features and hair don't typify those of a 1st century Middle Eastern Jew.
.

 

[beancounter]

.
Now it's getting plain ridiculous. I'm sure that Jesus was a careful shopper, but this cartoon's skin color, facial features and hair don't typify those of a Middle Eastern Jew.
.

What? Everyone knows that Jesus was a white European. And He couldn't have been Jewish because they have horns.

 

[Huckleberry]

Any possibility that a Catholic source attacking Harvey Weinstein for producing what they view as several anti-Catholic films could be just a smidge anti-Semitic? This would be consistent with the history of the RCC.

Why are you protective of Harvey Weinstein? Is criticism of any Jewish person, no matter how justified, not permitted? Do you really believe criticism of Harvey Weinstein or Jeffrey Epstein or Baruch Goldstein or Lazar Kaganovich should be forbidden? That seems just a smidge ridiculous.

 

[Huckleberry]

He is telling non Christians (therefore including Muslims and Jews) that they are not following God. That kind of discrimination doesn’t belong on this forum.

Are atheists allowed to criticize Muslims? Is that discrimination?

I think fact-based, rational criticism is okay. Blanket attacks on ethnic groups based on hysteria and stereotypes is not okay. In a free society even the second should usually be permitted absent any threats of violence.

 

[David3]

Are atheists allowed to criticize Muslims? Is that discrimination?

I think fact-based, rational criticism is okay. Blanket attacks on ethnic groups based on hysteria and stereotypes is not okay. In a free society even the second should usually be permitted absent any threats of violence.

.
Rational criticism, from either atheists or believers, is fine.

What isn't OK is to claim that an entire group of people is lost from God, and therefore going to hell. That kind of claim demeans their entire culture. And, it's not a rational claim, either - it's based on a faith-based text.

 

[David3]

Why are you protective of Harvey Weinstein? Is criticism of any Jewish person, no matter how justified, not permitted? Do you really believe criticism of Harvey Weinstein or Jeffrey Epstein or Baruch Goldstein or Lazar Kaganovich should be forbidden? That seems just a smidge ridiculous.

.
Watch the name-calling. Don't call people, or their words, "ridiculous". It just leads to hate.
.

 

[Urban Gardener]

There’s a difference between criticizing an ideology and attacking the people who believe in it.

Attacks on believers are justified when it’s something they chose during their adult life (political beliefs, for example) and there’s a direct impact on other people.

Religion is cultural - passed down through generations. It’s closely tied to cultural traditions and heritage.

Even when that’s not the case, it is still a private and personal belief system. The impact on others is usually nonexistant or at least indirect.

Reasonable: “This religion’s main text criticizes veganism, so I believe it advocates mistreatment of animals.”

Not Ok: “Therefore anyone who identifies with that religion for any reason is a horrible person and I won’t talk to them.”

Personally, I don’t see the point of critiquing other people’s religious beliefs. It doesn’t affect you, so it doesn’t matter. And it tends to go from Example A to Example B pretty quickly.

 

[Urban Gardener]

.
Watch the name-calling. Don't call people, or their words, "ridiculous". It just leads to hate.
.

I agree with this, and I don’t see how anyone here acted protective of Harvey Weinstein. One of his films was used as an example to make a separate point; that doesn’t imply support for him as a person.

 

[Brian W]

Attacks on believers are not justified because people are not deliberately believing something in order to be nasty. If you think somebody is wrong and that it is important, discuss and debate but don't attack. Logically speaking, there is no proof of God's existence or His non-existence. Logic is involved in faith, but so is desire, and the final proof of the pudding is in the eating. Those of us who believe have been led down a line of thought until we felt able to take a small leap of faith, and only then did God prove Himself to us. The certainty with which some people here are slighting religion reminds me of the arrogance of my teenage years. I was even into dark Magick for a period. Thankfully God pulled me out of that and now I am a committed Christian and, given my Christian experiences, there is no way I can ever become atheist or agnostic again. You believe what you want to, but let others do the same!

 

[Huckleberry]

.
Rational criticism, from either atheists or believers, is fine.

What isn't OK is to claim that an entire group of people is lost from God, and therefore going to hell. That kind of claim demeans their entire culture. And, it's not a rational claim, either - it's based on a faith-based text.

An atheist’s claim that there is no God would certainly demean Muslim culture. Such a belief would in fact eviscerate Muslim culture! Moreover, atheist hostility toward Muslims may be irrational, may be based on prejudice. Think of that mendacious war-monger Christopher Hitchens and his self-righteous Islamophobia.

 

[Huckleberry]

I agree with this, and I don’t see how anyone here acted protective of Harvey Weinstein. One of his films was used as an example to make a separate point; that doesn’t imply support for him as a person.

I disagree. A reasonable criticism of Weinstein was labeled “anti-Semitic”. That is surely protective.

 

[David3]

An atheist’s claim that there is no God would certainly demean Muslim culture. Such a belief would in fact eviscerate Muslim culture! Moreover, atheist hostility toward Muslims may be irrational, may be based on prejudice. Think of that mendacious war-monger Christopher Hitchens and his self-righteous Islamophobia.

I don’t go around telling Muslims that God doesn’t exist. I don’t make commentary on the prophet Mohammad. Where do you perceive atheist hostility towards Muslims in my words? My objection is to the faith- based claim that those who don’t follow Jesus are not saved. People have the right to make such statements, of course, but it doesn’t belong on this forum.

 

[Mostly Random Dude]

I follow the teaching of the only true gods - FSM, IPU and of course the celestial teapot.

Personally, I am a Pastafarian! He boiled for our sins!

 

[Huckleberry]

I don’t go around telling Muslims that God doesn’t exist. I don’t make commentary on the prophet Mohammad. Where do you perceive atheist hostility towards Muslims in my words? My objection is to the faith- based claim that those who don’t follow Jesus are not saved. People have the right to make such statements, of course, but it doesn’t belong on this forum.

I didn’t say you attacked Muslim culture. I am saying the atheist belief that there is no God to save us demeans Muslim culture at least as much as the claim of some Christians that Jesus does not save Muslims.