US US Politics 2024

[Second Summer]

Unintentional civilian deaths occur in all wars.

Yes, the Israelis can do no wrong, we get it. Oops, they killed 30,000+ people. Oops, they destroyed all the hospitals. Oops, they deliberately withheld food and water. Oops, they orchestrated a humanitarian catastrophe which is now developing into a famine.

No one here is defending Hamas. But the "human shields" argument doesn't hold up. Israel has blood on their hands.

 

[Lou]

Part of the problem is that the average American voter isn't getting the message, in part because the Dems haven't done a very good job of touting their leader's accomplishments. Part of that problem is that the progressive wing of the party isn't interested in Biden or his accomplishments -- they want a lot more from him -- so there isn't a united front in the way that the GOP often comes together despite their disdain for T.

I'm going to disagree with you there.
Biden has learned from Obama's mistakes and is getting out there and touting his accomplishments. Plus he is sending out his proxies and his cabinet to do it on the tv.
Here in California all the dems are lined up behind him, too.

Also, the average American doesn't do a whole lot of research into what Biden has done because they rely on a media that is more interested in headlines about Biden's age and his gaffes than the issues -- since issues don't sell. And then you have the GOP, which is hellbent on focusing on everything but the issues that matter to most Americans. They'd rather harp on Biden's age, the border situation (which T helped create), Hunter Biden, the Israel mess, Ukraine, etc.

I do agree with you there. But some media outlets are doing a pretty good job of walking back the misinformation. The problem is that if all you watch is Fox, then you just hear what the GOP wants you to hear.

And more rulings like the IVF one will happen because T was able to appoint a slew of judges at many levels. I do hope the IVF issue does bring T opponents to the polls because four more years of T could mean even more appointments of conservative judges and further eroding of Americans' rights.

Women's rights might be the thing that hurts the GOP the most. A lot of millennials don't vote but the women's issues are young women issues. The GOP might be marching them right to the polls.

I will never understand why people vote against their own interests. I know there are numerous theories/reasons for it, but I still don't get it.

Sometimes it's a values thing. but yeah....

I hear he has done a few good things domestically, which is after all what US voters tend to care about the most. However, inflation has hit hard on essential goods like groceries. This matters to US voters.

Inflation is a Democrat sore spot. But it is getting better . We can only hope it isnt' such a big issue come November.

And many voters are also not impressed with how long it took this administration to start taking the southern border issue seriously.

the southern border issue is mostly an invention of the GOP. most of us aren't affected by it. In fact they just reported that immigrants are boosting our economy.

If you look at foreign policy, though, the picture is perhaps even less flattering. His Afghan withdrawal was chaotic at best.

That was very sad. The Generals had 20 years to come up with an exit plan.

Much worse still is the genocide the Biden administration is supporting in occupied Palestine.

I don't blame Biden for that. the Israelis are totally screwing the pooch.

 

[PTree15]

I'm going to disagree with you there.
Biden has learned from Obama's mistakes and is getting out there and touting his accomplishments. Plus he is sending out his proxies and his cabinet to do it on the tv.
Here in California all the dems are lined up behind him, too.

California is not the rest of the country, especially the middle of the country, not to mention the South, which trends red.

I do agree with you there. But some media outlets are doing a pretty good job of walking back the misinformation. The problem is that if all you watch is Fox, then you just hear what the GOP wants you to hear.

And way too many people watch nothing but Fox in the U.S., and they don't pay attention to the outlets that are walking back the misinformation. They call anything like that lies. It's astonishing how widespread denial is among so many in this country.

 

[Emma JC]

from a north of the border perspective the most important thing "in my opinion" that the Democrats should be emphasizing is not just Biden but the amazing team of people that he has surrounded himself with that actually do the great things that have been happening - the Administration is the key so it doesn't really matter if Biden misses a word or stumbles because he has an entire team that supports him and is aligned with most of America's values - on the other hand I feel like *rump is a ventriloquist dummy with a ton of hands in his back like Stephen Miller and Steve Bannon and the hard-right evangelicals and the billionaires... I could go on... he is nothing but an empty shell that will surround himself with a team that wishes to take down democracy... please America... don't let it happen

Emma JC
Find your vegan soulmate or just a friend. www.spiritualmatchmaking.com

 

[beancounter]

Yes, the Israelis can do no wrong, we get it. Oops, they killed 30,000+ people. Oops, they destroyed all the hospitals. Oops, they deliberately withheld food and water. Oops, they orchestrated a humanitarian catastrophe which is now developing into a famine.

No one here is defending Hamas. But the "human shields" argument doesn't hold up. Israel has blood on their hands.

Again, intent is everything. Hamas has intentional blood on their hands.

Who is reporting the number of deaths? Hamas? Agencies that benefit from disaster? Especially those who have Hamas operatives working for them?
In other words, the more deaths they report, the more international sympathy/funding they gain, so they have motivation to inflate the numbers.

Hamas is not trustworthy source.

Assuming the numbers are true - 30K deaths vs a population of 4.9M - less than 1%, so the genocide arguments is complete BS propaganda.

The use of human shields is real, and repugnant, and "holds water" regardless of how many Palestinians died by the actions of Israel. That is the two are mutually exclusive and have not bearing on the other.

Israel issues warnings before they attack. Does Hamas do that?..

The hospitals were hiding tunnels used by Hamas. Hamas was using staff and patients as human shields.

The use of human shields makes it virtually impossible to do a precision strike. So what's the solution? Just pull back and let Hamas endlessly launch modern Iranian supplied missiles at Israel?

Even when Israel launched a precision strike in a hospital, those complaining about civilian casualties still weren't happy. So Israel is damned if they do and damned if they don't.

If you tell someone they should do X, they do X and them you blame them for doing X.....

When someone tells you that they want to exterminate you, only a fool doesn't take them seriously...

The two state solution was rejected by Hamas...

Supporting Hamas doesn't support the Palestinians. It supports Iran.

 

[Lou]

Again, intent is everything. Hamas has intentional blood on their hands.

I've been feeling sick about this whole thing for a while now. very conflicted. Thanks your perspective makes me feel better.

 

[Brian W]

Yes, the Israelis can do no wrong, we get it. Oops, they killed 30,000+ people. Oops, they destroyed all the hospitals. Oops, they deliberately withheld food and water. Oops, they orchestrated a humanitarian catastrophe which is now developing into a famine.

No one here is defending Hamas. But the "human shields" argument doesn't hold up. Israel has blood on their hands.

Living Under the Shadow of Death

The Hamas Covenant begins by stating that Israel “will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it”, and the means of doing so is “jihad”. It categorically rejects any form of negotiated peace settlement and condemns Fatah for having engaged in such negotiations. The reason Hamas rejects any peace settlement is because (Article 11) it: “… believes that the land of Palestine is an Islamic Waqf [legal Trust] consecrated for future Moslem generations until Judgement Day.” The Covenant goes on to explain precisely what this means by explaining that when the Islamic armies conquered Palestine, they asked the Umar, the second Caliph (successor to Muhammad as head of the entire Islamic community), whether the conquered land should be divided among the Islamic soldiers or left with its previous owners. The Caliph’s decision, made after consulting the other surviving Companions of Muhammad, was that while the previous owners – who were predominantly Christians and Jews - should be allowed to farm it, it would now be owned by the Islamic community for perpetuity. This decision now forms part of shari’a – and therefore cannot be altered.


In other words, it is a denial of the right of non-Muslims to own land in Palestine.


Article 11 also states that this principle applies to any land, which at any time has been conquered by Islamic armies. In other words, it is a denial of the right of non-Muslims to own land in Palestine. So, when the 2017 Hamas Charter (Article 10) says that, “Christian holy sites belong exclusively to the Palestinian people and to the Arab and Islamic Ummah [i.e. global Islamic community]”, it is effectively claiming Islamic ownership of Christian sites in Palestine.

Please forgive me if I cannot blame Israel for defending their land, their religion and their people!

Exposed: Hamas’s propaganda team - The Jerusalem Post

 

[silva]

Just what is happening to trumpian woman? It's gone beyond anything rationale. Maybe I'm being sexist, but I see the men under his thumb having very selfish goals in their allegiance, but so many women just come across as puppets and brain washed.
Not only the seemingly drugged Katie Britts response to the State of the Union address, but did you hear Rep Nancy Mace on This Week....?

Nancy Mace erupts at ABC anchor during fiery exchange on Trump rape accusations

 

[Lou]

Please forgive me if I cannot blame Israel for defending their land, their religion and their people!

Yes. But...;

I see them making the same mistake that the US has done in something like the last 3 or 4 wars.
Do they have a viable end game?
An exit strategy?
What does a Win look like?

 

[Lou]

Just what is happening to trumpian woman? It's gone beyond anything rationale. Maybe I'm being sexist, but I see the men under his thumb having very selfish goals in their allegiance, but so many women just come across as puppets and brain washed.
Not only the seemingly drugged Katie Britts response to the State of the Union address, but did you hear Rep Nancy Mace on This Week....?

Nancy Mace erupts at ABC anchor during fiery exchange on Trump rape accusations

Yes but let's not stop with the females.
There are Mexican Americans who support Trump. (could this be an "I got mine and you can't have it" thing.
There are Palestinian Americans who support Trump. Do they think Biden is Too pro Israel. What do they think Trump is?
there are Black Americans who support Trump (this could be more mind boggling than the women who support Trump)
And maybe the worse thing is the Evangelical Trumpers. Twice divorced, cheats on his wife, Stups a porn star, can not quote the Bible. and considers himself a diety. How can they support him except that they are totally hung up on just one issue.

 

[silva]

Yes but let's not stop with the females.
There are Mexican Americans who support Trump. (could this be an "I got mine and you can't have it" thing.
There are Palestinian Americans who support Trump. Do they think Biden is Too pro Israel. What do they think Trump is?
there are Black Americans who support Trump (this could be more mind boggling than the women who support Trump)
And maybe the worse thing is the Evangelical Trumpers. Twice divorced, cheats on his wife, Stups a porn star, can not quote the Bible. and considers himself a diety. How can they support him except that they are totally hung up on just one issue.

Oh of course,but it's just hitting me so hard with these women and their performative acts. I can see through the others having their own personal agendas, I can't understand that from their woman, what they have to gain? Or for that matter, a trans woman I work with that holds very very conservative views. I don't even know how to respond.
Here is Britts response. How many lies can you spot?

and Nancy Mace-

 

[Lou]

My guess is that they are hoping for either becoming VP or on the Supreme Court.

 

[silva]

My guess is that they are hoping for either becoming VP or on the Supreme Court.

It's so dam painful to hear so many groveling at a lunatics feet. Here in Ohio the republican primaries for senate seat is which of the three is the most despicable. Oh,, he's smart-don't vote for him. That one voted for something that was beneficial--don't vote for him. .
Sherrod Brown is the dem holding the seat now, and while I dislike his commercials the republicans are boasting him up as far as I can tell

 

[Lou]

I don't know much about Ohio politics. but the hosts of the Podcast, Pod Save America are big fans of Sherrod Brown. He is a D senator running for governor? Why would Republican "Boast Him up"? Wait. what does it mean to "Boast Him up"?
BTW, I haven't seen his commercials. what is wrong with them?

 

[Andy_T]

Wait. what does it mean to "Boast Him up"?

My guess would be that by being Repugnicans, and horrible, they would get Ohio voters to vote for him instead?

 

[silva]

I don't know much about Ohio politics. but the hosts of the Podcast, Pod Save America are big fans of Sherrod Brown. He is a D senator running for governor? Why would Republican "Boast Him up"? Wait. what does it mean to "Boast Him up"?
BTW, I haven't seen his commercials. what is wrong with them?

Sherrod Browns commercials are trying to cater to everyone, which really does a disservice to the more progressive democrats who want so much more.
I will say the 3 repubs are just sooooooo deplorable you'd have to be a moron to vote for any of them. Not saying they can't win of course . Only need to compare the campaign of our last gubernatorial election when we got DeWine

The more extreme the gop goes the more the dems follow

 

[Andy_T]

I will say the 3 repubs are just sooooooo deplorable you'd have to be a moron to vote for any of them. Not saying they can't win of course . Only need to compare the campaign of our last gubernatorial election when we got DeWine

Sigh, it’s Ohio, after all

Historic elections seem to put it in the “sh**hole state” category….

 

[beancounter]

 

[silva]

Sigh, it’s Ohio, after all

Historic elections seem to put it in the “sh**hole state” category….

I'm by Cleveland, which should really be somewhere else . It's pretty shocking when you get out of the larger cities it's mostly so backwards

 

[Lou]

Sigh, it’s Ohio, after all

Historic elections seem to put it in the “sh**hole state” category….

I don't know about that.
I wouldn't even put them in the "Top Ten" or bottom ten ... whatever.
They are more Red than Florida and Texas but at least they don't bus migrants to NYC.