US US Politics 2024

[Second Summer]

New year, new thread. This is a continuation of the 2023 thread.

So, what do you think the Supreme Court is going to decide in the disqualification case against Trump? Will they find some excuse not to disqualify him from holding office again, or will they do what some experts think is the only possible outcome and actually disqualify him?

 

[Lou]

New year, new thread. This is a continuation of the 2023 thread.

So, what do you think the Supreme Court is going to decide in the disqualification case against Trump? Will they find some excuse not to disqualify him from holding office again, or will they do what some experts think is the only possible outcome and actually disqualify him?

That is a good question and it keeps me up at night.
there is a More than a good chance that "they find some reason not to disqualify him".
There is a slim chance that some of them wake up and smell the coffee.

The other thing that keeps me up at night is the same thing that I was saying in 2015. Even if we get rid of Trump, what are we going to do with all the Trumpers.

I'm somewhat isolated from them, living in the bluest part of the country. But I watch my TV shows at a site that allows for comments. And I am reminded that a very significant percentage of the population are misogynist, homophobic, islamophobic, and racist.

So even if they disqualify him, or he loses in an election, or if he goes to jail - The Trumpers are not going away.

 

[Second Summer]

So even if they disqualify him, or he loses in an election, or if he goes to jail - The Trumpers are not going away.

In some sense, perhaps both Trump and the Trumpers are more symptoms than the actual underlying diseases?

It seems the "American Dream" has died and that huge swathes of the population are struggling to make ends meet. Meanwhile, corporations and billionaires are running off with an ever-increasing share of the profits. This isn't unique to the US, of course, but it may be worse there than many other places in the western world because workers' rights, workers' solidarity and the power of unions have historically all been so weak there.

Anyway, those are my 2 cents on that topic.

 

[Lou]

In some sense, perhaps both Trump and the Trumpers are more symptoms than the actual underlying diseases?

It seems the "American Dream" has died and that huge swathes of the population are struggling to make ends meet. Meanwhile, corporations and billionaires are running off with an ever-increasing share of the profits. This isn't unique to the US, of course, but it may be worse there than many other places in the western world because workers' rights, workers' solidarity and the power of unions have historically all been so weak there.

Anyway, those are my 2 cents on that topic.

I'm not willing to make excuses for Trump or Trumpers.
All the things you said are true. But I don't feel it excuses racism and hate.

And Americans by and large have it pretty good comparatively speaking. Sure it could be much better but I see Trump and Trumpers are more of a problem than a solution.

 

[Second Summer]

I'm not willing to make excuses for Trump or Trumpers.
All the things you said are true. But I don't feel it excuses racism and hate.

Sure, but if it at least helps to explain it, then maybe we are one step closer to solving this problem.

And Americans by and large have it pretty good comparatively speaking.

I think people tend to compare themselves more to the older generations than to other nations, although both comparisons matter.

If they feel they are worse off than their parents' generation, then they might start feeling like the country is moving in the wrong direction. And that is when they turn to people like Trump.

 

[Lou]

Sure, but if it at least helps to explain it, then maybe we are one step closer to solving this problem.

I like that sentiment

 

[Second Summer]

It's still some time until November, but the numbers are strongly favouring Trump. (Screenshot from RealClearPolitics.com this morning.)

The Dems need to get rid of Biden, but it's probably too late. Even if they did have another candidate ready to step in and replace Biden, they have wasted too much time already.

 

[Lou]

I couldn't decide where this story belongs.
So I put it here.

https://www.npr.org/2024/02/29/1234894445/new-york-lawsuit-jbs-climate-change-beef-food-agriculture

So in a nutshell: NY State is suing a major meat producer for misleading the public. The company, JBS, said they had a plan to reduce global warming. And it turns out - they don't.

NY is seeking fines and also halting JBS's claims.

 

[Andy_T]

It boggles my mind how any normally thinking person could think going out and voting for Dump is a sensible idea.

However, we are talking about 'murrican voters here, so, unfortunately, all bets are off .

 

[PTree15]

It boggles my mind how any normally thinking person could think going out and voting for Dump is a sensible idea.

However, we are talking about 'murrican voters here, so, unfortunately, all bets are off .

It boggles my mind as well. It's so disheartening for those of us who want nothing to do with Dump. I was watching interviews of voters, and I just couldn't believe what I was hearing. I guess they don't remember, or don't want to acknowledge, the disaster that his presidency was on so many levels.

 

[Andy_T]

As Michael Moore put it in 2017 ...

"When I see 3 white Americans coming my way on the street, I change to the other side of the road, because I know that two of them voted for Dump"

 

[Lou]

It's still some time until November, but the numbers are strongly favouring Trump. (Screenshot from RealClearPolitics.com this morning.)

The Dems need to get rid of Biden, but it's probably too late. Even if they did have another candidate ready to step in and replace Biden, they have wasted too much time already.

Don't buy into the hype that Biden is a bad president. He is one of the best. Ever.
If you just look past the polls you will see he has done such a good job.

• Lowering Costs of Families' Everyday Expenses.
• More People Are Working Than At Any Point in American History.
• Making More in America.
• Rescued the Economy and Changed the Course of the Pandemic.
• Rebuilding our Infrastructure.
• Historic Expansion of Benefits and Services for Toxic Exposed Veterans.
• etc, etc.

And all this with a hostile congress.

And probably should be noted that the DNC has totally outpreformed the RNC in fundraising this year.

The Biden-Harris Record | The White House

 

[Lou]

Meanwhile speaking of stupid Americans...
have you seen the guy who just won the North Carolina primary?
He wants to abolish abortion rights. His goal is a six week ban.
He is pro gun, believes covid was a global conspiracy, anti LBGQT, quotes hitler, hates teachers, and has stated that slaves got paid. Also endorses trump and Trumps Big Lie.
Oh, and he didn't like the movie the Black Panther.

Mark Robinson, Holocaust-Denying, Gay-Bashing Candidate, Wins NC Gubernatorial Primary | Democracy Now!

Why it matters that the GOP’s Mark Robinson won a gubernatorial primary

 

[beancounter]

The recent anti IVF ruling is bound to bring people to the poles.

Also, the Muslim community may have voiced their displeasure at Biden, but I can't see them voting for (or at least allowing him to win by staying home) the guy who banned them briefly, and is fiercely anti minority.

 

[PTree15]

Don't buy into the hype that Biden is a bad president. He is one of the best. Ever.
If you just look past the polls you will see he has done such a good job.

• Lowering Costs of Families' Everyday Expenses.
• More People Are Working Than At Any Point in American History.
• Making More in America.
• Rescued the Economy and Changed the Course of the Pandemic.
• Rebuilding our Infrastructure.
• Historic Expansion of Benefits and Services for Toxic Exposed Veterans.
• etc, etc.

And all this with a hostile congress.

And probably should be noted that the DNC has totally outpreformed the RNC in fundraising this year.

The Biden-Harris Record | The White House

Part of the problem is that the average American voter isn't getting the message, in part because the Dems haven't done a very good job of touting their leader's accomplishments. Part of that problem is that the progressive wing of the party isn't interested in Biden or his accomplishments -- they want a lot more from him -- so there isn't a united front in the way that the GOP often comes together despite their disdain for T.

Also, the average American doesn't do a whole lot of research into what Biden has done because they rely on a media that is more interested in headlines about Biden's age and his gaffes than the issues -- since issues don't sell. And then you have the GOP, which is hellbent on focusing on everything but the issues that matter to most Americans. They'd rather harp on Biden's age, the border situation (which T helped create), Hunter Biden, the Israel mess, Ukraine, etc.

And more rulings like the IVF one will happen because T was able to appoint a slew of judges at many levels. I do hope the IVF issue does bring T opponents to the polls because four more years of T could mean even more appointments of conservative judges and further eroding of Americans' rights.

I will never understand why people vote against their own interests. I know there are numerous theories/reasons for it, but I still don't get it.

 

[silva]

Part of the problem is that the average American voter isn't getting the message, in part because the Dems haven't done a very good job of touting their leader's accomplishments. Part of that problem is that the progressive wing of the party isn't interested in Biden or his accomplishments -- they want a lot more from him -- so there isn't a united front in the way that the GOP often comes together despite their disdain for T.

The dems have shown they'll side with trumpians before the progressives
Honestly, I do feel we wouldn't have had trump if Hilaries campaign didn't make such a point of undermining Bernies

 

[PTree15]

The dems have shown they'll side with trumpians before the progressives
Honestly, I do feel we wouldn't have had trump if Hilaries campaign didn't make such a point of undermining Bernies

Yep, agree. The Dems really screwed up regarding Bernie. I know of a couple of Bernie supporters who voted for T because they couldn't stand Hillary.

 

[Second Summer]

Don't buy into the hype that Biden is a bad president. He is one of the best. Ever.

I hear he has done a few good things domestically, which is after all what US voters tend to care about the most. However, inflation has hit hard on essential goods like groceries. This matters to US voters.

And many voters are also not impressed with how long it took this administration to start taking the southern border issue seriously.

If you look at foreign policy, though, the picture is perhaps even less flattering. His Afghan withdrawal was chaotic at best. Many of the Afghan government forces - some of them elite forces, but their government ordered them to stand down - and they ended up between a rock and a hard place, completely failed by the US (and their coalition partners as well). And of course, the Taliban coming so easily back in power is not a great outcome either.

Much worse still is the genocide the Biden administration is supporting in occupied Palestine. Yes, theoretically, Trump would have done the same thing. But Biden is the one who is responsible for what is actually happening now - through Israel aid, a complete failure to put effective pressure on the genocidal Israeli government and endless UN sec. council vetoes. This must be incredibly demoralising to progressive Democrats.

 

[beancounter]

Unintentional civilian deaths occur in all wars.

Oct 7th was intentional. That is a world of difference.

Strange how this is the only war where civilian deaths are lamented with such intensity...

The Hamas propaganda machine is very busy.

Of course, some seem to forget the use of human shields. Using your own people as human shields....

And the explicit intention to exterminate the Jews, and create a worldwide Islamic caliphate. (Which Christians may want to pay attention to...)

Yea, they're the good guys. Sure.

1988 Hamas charter - Wikipedia

 

[beancounter]

What Americans don’t get about Israelis Fighting for their Lives | The Jewish Press - JewishPress.com | Jonathan S. Tobin | 12 Adar I 5784 – Wednesday, February 21, 2024 | JewishPress.com

"This war is between a democratic nation fighting for its existence against an Islamist movement whose goal is the destruction of Israel and the Jewish people. Yet many outside of Israel, even those who do know the history and essential nature of the two sides in this struggle, such as President Joe Biden and U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken, are increasingly speaking as if the only thing to do is to end the war as soon as possible. They say the aftermath of the war must mean that Hamas survives—and gets away with mass murder. That means the Palestinians are rewarded for such abominations with an independent state that will likely have the ability to pursue the terrorist organization’s goal for many more days like Oct. 7. Somehow, that makes sense in Washington and other places."