Go Green now if You Dislike Trump

[Jamie in Chile]

Until they get the battery issue fixed I won't be considering an EV. Just last week for example a Tesla owner , I think it was Germany, and his two daughters died in a EV battery fire. The car hit a tree and locked them all inside when the power went off. A man in a business across the street from the accident couldn't put out the fire because you can't put an EV battery fire out with water (and EV batteries are known to re-ignite later even after the chemical sprays used to put them out are administered just FYI). Also the harvesting of the minerals needed for EV batteries are abhorrent, sometimes children do the work. Deep sea mining for minerals is being looked into which is, to me, insane when it comes to the safety of ocean life and the ocean waters.
Plus the pollution run off from broken solar panels into the environment which affects the wild animal life, and water, plants, etc..
There are so many issues still with this stuff that I can't seriously consider it at this time.

Yes, as Lou says EVs the lowest fire risk. Some say 20 times lower risk, some say 50 or 60 times lower. Some of these studies are based on entire countries collecting the data on every fire. I think EV fires are slower to start, giving you more time to get away (not certain on this). So, even if EV fires are worse (which is really just speculation) it would still be overall safer to drive an EV.

Deep sea mining is not being used to produce EVs today, so it's not a relevant factor in today's purchase price. If you are concern about seas/oceans you should note that oil spills have happened a number of times so that people can have petrol and diesel cars.

Solar panels do have some environmental issues but they are negligible compared to petrol and diesel cars - solar panels might have some run off into the environment? But petrol and diesel cars are literally spraying pollution from their tailpipe into schools and hospitals. How can people be more concerned about the former than the latter.

EVs are just better.

 

[Lou]

ok here is a negative but easily mittigated.

When I had my old car it was actually cheaper to take public transportation than to drive.
Public transportation almost always took longer and was usually less convenient. Except when going into the city where parking and traffic were factored in.
But because of the cost I took public transportation when ever it was half way convenient

Now not so much.
its now cheaper for me to drive to most places.

Then last weekend I did go into the city. After parking a mile away and walking to my destination I realized that i missed a good opportunity to take the train.

Another thing is that I'm putting on a lot more miles than I used to.

Easily mitigated by me by just remembering to continue to consider public trans and to going back to using the strategies to put less mileage on the car.

 

[Jamie in Chile]

It does seem to make sense in theory that adoption of EVs will lead to more miles driven locally. This doesn't matter from an environmental perspective, since EVs are so dramatically better on a per mile basis that the total impact will still be lower. But it could cause more traffic jams and traffic accidents.

As a counter point, EVs are slightly less convenient for very long drives, so in theory buses, trains and flights could slightly increase for longer distances as a result of EVs. Or people could just travel less. This might conversely have a benefit for traffic.

In practice though, there isn't a trend showing up strongly one way or the other. If you search online you'll find some studies showing EV drivers do a bit more miles, some showing a bit less, and some variation by year and by country. It's a bit difficult to compare since EV users are early adopters that don't represent the whole population. There could be factors such as people drive more in EVs because that's their main (newer) car and less miles in petrol (gas) car (some families may need two cars, but rarely in practice need the older petrol car). So over time petrol car average mileage might decline if people are just using them as the backup car. So hard to compare in equivalent situations.

 

[PTree15]

ok here is a negative but easily mittigated.

When I had my old car it was actually cheaper to take public transportation than to drive.
Public transportation almost always took longer and was usually less convenient. Except when going into the city where parking and traffic were factored in.
But because of the cost I took public transportation when ever it was half way convenient

Now not so much.
its now cheaper for me to drive to most places.

Then last weekend I did go into the city. After parking a mile away and walking to my destination I realized that i missed a good opportunity to take the train.

Another thing is that I'm putting on a lot more miles than I used to.

Easily mitigated by me by just remembering to continue to consider public trans and to going back to using the strategies to put less mileage on the car.

I take public transportation as much as I can, but it isn't always convenient because of how much longer it takes to get anywhere. So when I don't have time constraints, I'll take the bus in CT. Buses in my area run about once an hour, so if you miss the one you really need, you're stuck for another hour. And that's just to get to Hartford, which is a 15-minute drive. So most times it's more convenient to drive. But when I've gone to protests and whatnot, I've taken the bus. It is easier than dealing with parking downtown.

When I go to Boston, I drive to the T station just outside Boston (as there isn't an affordable train from my area to Boston) and take that into downtown. It's a trolley/subway system with several lines that's fine for getting around the city, as the trains run quite often. It's only $2.40 a ride, and you can transfer quite a bit one way without having to pay more. When I go to Veggie Galaxy, I take two lines to get there, but it still costs only $2.40. Not too bad.

 

[Lou]

I wonder if smart phones get enough credit for saving gas.
When I use Apple Maps, there is a walking to get there option, a public transportation option and a driving option. And the amount of time and the cost are all calculated for me.
Plus of course it gives me directions to the stations. if the bus or train run frequently if even says when the next one is. Sometimes it even tells me if the train is running late.
It makes it so much easier and lowers my anxiety, too.

When I was taking the bus and/or train a lot I had started shopping for an electric scooter to solve the "last mile problem".

 

[Lou]

I might have bought a used Tesla if I knew about these bumper stickers.

Etsy anti - Elon bumper stickes

 

[Jamie in Chile]

A used Tesla with some kind of anti-Elon sticker is a good option.

You are not supporting Elon much buying a second hand cars and most car OEMs have some kind of ethical issue or another.

I've driven Teslas a couple of times as rentals and they have a premium feel to them in my opinion. They have a decent range and access to Tesla superchargers which, unlike other chargers in North America, are as reliable as gas stations and not too expensive. Teslas even though they are considered premium-ish can still compete with price for overall cost against gas cars quite well.

However, it's annoying having to find in touchscreen menu something that would be used to having a knob/dial/button for, for example a radio. This makes them annoying the first day but presumably you get used to it.

You can get some good prices on used Teslas and when you look at these prices remember the tremendous savings on gas as well!

 

[Lou]

A used Tesla with some kind of anti-Elon sticker is a good option.

Yeah. I'm almost sorry I didn't go that route.

However, it's annoying having to find in touchscreen menu something that would be used to having a knob/dial/button for, for example a radio. This makes them annoying the first day but presumably you get used to it.

My sister had one and maybe she got used to it but she always thought it was a stupid design.

 

[Lou]

Like PTree, our electric rates are one of the highest, in the country. I can barely use the heating in winter. My bill in February was $635

Gosh. that makes me feel better about living in California with the high rent.

 

[Lou]

So just a little update.
I have yet to charge while I'm at the gym. Instead I just hit the grocery store before 8. and go to the gym on different days. The gym and grocery store are only 2 miles away. I try to combine chores but I don't like the idea of a 5 minute walk in the dark and cold to get from the charging station to the gym. Besides it takes me almost 2 hours to finish at the gym. Just 30 minutes to finish shopping. And so far non of my charging sessions have last much more than 40 minutes.

An interesting side effect of going grocery shopping before 8 is that there are no lines in the store at that time. I've also found that I'm more likely to just stop in for a quickie and some milk (or whatever I run out of). 15 minutes = 50 more miles.

Neither here nor there but I was just informed by EvGo that GM gave me an $80 credit towards the purchase of electricity. Since EvGo is the charging station at the supermarket and also the one near Longs, CVS, and a Starbucks its basically free money. The credit expires at the new year. I may have to drive a little extra in December to use it all up. Maybe I can do some sight seeing.

 

[Lou]

here is a little help with the math
I travel about 4 miles per KWH. (pretty average for an EV)
at EvGo the cost of a KWH is about 44¢
So every mile costs me about 10¢

or 100 miles for $10

how far can you go on $10 of gas?

 

[PTree15]

here is a little help with the math
I travel about 4 miles per KWH. (pretty average for an EV)
at EvGo the cost of a KWH is about 44¢
So every mile costs me about 10¢

or 100 miles for $10

how far can you go on $10 of gas?

For me, I can go around 106 miles on $10 of gas. I have a Subaru Impreza hatchback. I average about 32 mpg if I combine city driving with highway driving. Gas in my area is about $2.99 per gallon (but I often go to Costco, which averages 15 to 20 cents lower per gallon), so I would get 3.34 gallons for $10, which translates into around 106 miles.

 

[Jamie in Chile]

100 miles for $10

This is for public charging.

If Lou could charge at home it would be cheaper.

You can sometimes get off-peak rates and mainly charge then (usually overnight).

When you can charge from home 100 miles might be $5 or less.

 

[Lou]

This is for public charging.

If Lou could charge at home it would be cheaper.

You can sometimes get off-peak rates and mainly charge then (usually overnight).

When you can charge from home 100 miles might be $5 or less.

I knew I would never be able to charge at home. Sometimes I charge when visiting my sister.
gas in California is $5 a gallon.
If I bought a high mileage car instead I would still cost about the same.

 

[PTree15]

This is for public charging.

If Lou could charge at home it would be cheaper.

You can sometimes get off-peak rates and mainly charge then (usually overnight).

When you can charge from home 100 miles might be $5 or less.

Yep, it would be cheaper at home for sure. If I were to get an EV and charge it at home, I would have upgrade my electrical panel, as mine is near capacity. That would be the way to go, though. I'm pretty sure CT has special rates/programs for EV charging.