If anything, she is being too understanding, but it's better than some of the OTT attacks previously
Alex O'Connor no longer vegan
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VeganRachel
Forum Legend
There are many articles and video's about why humans try but do not succeed at veganism. Some of the largest reasons are consuming an
imbalanced and inadequate whole food diet, and, not getting enough B12. Many humans eat what they want to and assume that therefore
they are getting all the nutrition they need. Another problem is having a hard time being different and socializing as a vegan, and handling the
vast amount of criticism of vegans.
I did not watch his video's if he explained the details of why he changed. One large 'problem' is that if a vegan is not feeling well, and they
go to a conventional doctor, nutritionist etcetera. They overwhelminlgy suggest to the person to start eating animal products. I read an article
by a vegan who had just had a baby. She staretd feeling awful and eventually went to a few doctors. The last one gave her a blood test and it
revealed her cholesterol, and iron, was very low. Instead of eating animal products, which was suggested, she pressed the doctor who finally stated she
could try eating coconut oil and more beans, and see if that helped. It did and she felt better.
Brian W
Conscientious Christian
Just found a comment under Unnatural Vegan's video.
Looks like a little drama might be unfolding!
Chryssie
Internet Junkie
I never heard of this person. Maybe I have been living under a rock? 
Brian W
Conscientious Christian
His YouTube channel is called CosmicSkeptic and he usually posts atheist logic videos attempting to debunk Christianity. He's usually an excellent debater and he seems like a really nice guy as well so this move of his away from veganism is difficult to understand.I never heard of this person. Maybe I have been living under a rock?
Lou
Forum Legend
This came out today. sort of relevant.
I didn't read the whole thing but I felt I could counsel most of the ones I read. but the first one. I actually related to the first one.
The rest of the issues seemed pretty easy to mitigate.
I didn't read the whole thing but I felt I could counsel most of the ones I read. but the first one. I actually related to the first one.
The rest of the issues seemed pretty easy to mitigate.
He won't be able to prove there is any nutritional benefit from eating animal products. Nor will he be able to prove humans are "omnivores", like we were taught and so many want to believe. Humans are frugivores. Dogs are true omnivores. Our GI tracts are nearly identical to gorillas. Also Nature provided food for mammals and living beings to be eaten in its natural state. Humans have hands to pick fruit off trees. We don't have teeth designed to kill and then eat dead animals like dogs do (nor would we care to) and we can't digest it nearly as well. Everyone should know that the story we were all taught about the so called "Paleo Era" where man supposedly killed animals with crude tools and cooked them for food was debunked. They found fossilized stools that contained far too much fiber for any meat to have been consumed. Dr. Michael Greger reported on this discovery ages ago. If you look up "Paleo Poo" you can find it.I think my main concern is that he had built up quite a following based on his logical approach to veganism, and the reply, especially the way he has worded it is only going to add fire to the frankly, illogical and countless debunked arguments against plant-based diets.
I really hope he puts out a well-researched explanation video, because frankly, right now I feel almost personally betrayed (and I know I shouldn't).
It's a smack in the teeth from someone I had held in a very high regard.
VeganRachel
Forum Legend
Thank you for your insightful comments. Most humans eat what they have been taught to eat as "food" and keep repeating their unhealthy habits.
They follow what everyone elkse does as well. Few humans investigate the validity of comparative anatomy in all animals, which clearly show
what our body, by design, was meant to consume. It is true, human animals CAN consume flesh and blood, but we can also consume wood pulp
(once added to bread to lower the calories), pig intestines/chitlins (which smell abhorrently), moldy cheese such as blue cheese, limburger cheese,
stinky fermented rotten tofu (no offense to anyone's cultural habits), human flesh-- including committing infanticide, insects, one man ground up his car and consumed it, and an abomination of other putrid products that are moldy or rotten. None of these things we have eaten prove that these are a natural healthy part of our 'diet'. See this wonderful detailed color comparative anatomy chart: https://freefromharm.org/wp-content...natomy-of-carnivores-omnivores-herbivores.jpg
VeganRachel
Forum Legend
Thanks for sharing. Yes I agree, the excuses were overwhelmingly dumb. From all that I read, I gather that
al-most all of them were not consuming a healthy diet, were therefore malnourished including of B12 and iron,
they did not seek professional help to evaluate their dietary choices, gave in to temptation when they felt the need,
wanted to be "normal" again, etcetera. Consuming the familiar flesh and blood made them 'feel" better because the flesh
contained the substances that their inadequate diet, lacked.
No vegan or omnivore should normally have to consume iron pills. There is plenty of iron in beans, beets, and other foods.
I have my doubts he will even try to prove what you suggest. And in the end, he doesn't need to. Of course he should explain himself clearly, but in the end it could be (my guess) a psychological issue...depression, social exclusion...who knows?
I also don't hold with the view that we are frugivores. There are quite clearly at least a couple of vitamins we cannot readily get from plants that if we do not supplement, we get ill.,..
We are omnivores in that we can eat both plant and animal products. Denying it is counter-productive.
There are also a lot of plants which we cannot digest without cooking first, and some that are poisonous until thoroughly cooked. Others need cooking in order that the nutrients are more readily digestible...whereas meat from many animals can be eaten raw and the nutrients more easily digested.
I personally think a plant-based raw food diet is both dangerous and a bit of an unnecessary fad. The only raw diet that could give us all we need without supplementing is one that includes animal products.
And if we go back just 100 years, it would have been almost impossible for the majority of the human population to only eat plant-based.
The only reason we are around today is because our ancestors were farmers. Crops fail and we needed fall-back nutrients. Oxen helped plough our fields, dogs helped reduce "pests", sheep and cows gave us clothes.
None of this matters of course in the modern world. We simply "don't need" to breed and kill animals or hold them in servitude for their milk nowadays.
For me, that's all that matters.
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VeganRachel
Forum Legend
Hi, we all have our beliefs and opinions and many believe humans are omnivores
--However, there is a hidden human history of spiritual christians, essene's, Ebionites where most, if not all humans, were strict vegetarians. The corrupt rulers and some in the church wanted us to satanically eat the dead and promoted it. Too much to explain. Do some research and find out.
--See my posts above and the comparative anatomy chart.
Also, TRUE omnivore and carnivore animals can handle mass amounts of vitamin A, can make their own vitamin C, can eat rotten putrid
animal flesh without getting sick, have short intestines to eliminate animal matter so it does not rot and putrefy, can consume ONE meal
a week and have a much larger stomach than we do. Humans, cannot/do not. Our stomach is small, indicating we are designed to consume
several small meals every day (except for occasional inetermittent fasting), NOT large meals. Humans have adapted to eating the dead and
enjoy doing it. It is both a habit and an addiction. I grew up doing it. That does not indicate it is our natural biological diet.
--I was 100% raw for many years and it is a perfectl;y natural diet and you can get enough to eat. I was living in a 4 season climate but eventually became more flexible and now eat some cooked foods, Raw is not for everyone but it is possible and healthy when you get enough to eat.
cheers.
Brian W
Conscientious Christian
I would like to see the research you have done and find out what scientists and theologians actually say on this matter; i.e. those who have actual knowledge of the appropriate issues rather than YouTube conspiracy theorists.
Graeme M
Forum Legend
Humans are omnivores, end of story. Sure, we are descended from creatures who may have been primarily frugivorous, but that means nothing after hundreds of thousands of years of adaptation. Creatures adapt rapidly to available foods, they simply have to or they cease to exist. One human adaptation to eating animals is the need for exogenous B12. Another is probably lactase persistence. There are more besides. Humans eat animals because they can and it works in a selective sense. I would think a raw food diet is probably unsuitable for most people nowadays just because we humans do not sit around eating all day like gorillas do. A completely plant-based diet may work for some people, I am yet to be convinced it can work for all. Still, within vegan ethics that is a worthwhile goal to aim for. Perhaps it doesn't work for Cosmic Skeptic.
Agreed. Although a raw food diet including meat and fish would almost certainly work too.
I saw a video of a small tribe in I think Siberia who still catch wild animals, cut them open and eat the still warm flesh...
Damn, and I haven't had my breakfast yet...
I just had all my blood tests for my yearly physical. I had been feeling a little tired, but assumed this was a normal part of aging. My blood test showed mild anemia.
I started looking around for some online recommendations of iron supplements, and ran into the carni crowd talking about how iron from animal sources was better. I wonder how they thought the iron got into the animal. Yes, the animal got it from plant sources.
I decided on Floravital iron + herbs. Two days later woke up at 6 am, had breakfast, and went for a walk. Felt great and my energy levels are up.
If he was not feeling good, he should have had a blood test done, and then added the necessary supplements to his daily routine.
I supplement with calcium, B12, B6, Vitamin K, D3, and iron. Everything, except, for the iron and B12, is to ward off future osteoporosis.
I think a simple blood test, followed by supplements, would have been the easiest fix.
I started looking around for some online recommendations of iron supplements, and ran into the carni crowd talking about how iron from animal sources was better. I wonder how they thought the iron got into the animal. Yes, the animal got it from plant sources.
I decided on Floravital iron + herbs. Two days later woke up at 6 am, had breakfast, and went for a walk. Felt great and my energy levels are up.
If he was not feeling good, he should have had a blood test done, and then added the necessary supplements to his daily routine.
I supplement with calcium, B12, B6, Vitamin K, D3, and iron. Everything, except, for the iron and B12, is to ward off future osteoporosis.
I think a simple blood test, followed by supplements, would have been the easiest fix.
I used to think like you. I thought supplements were the answer to perfect health until I learned how they are made and that Vitamins and mineral supplements are chemical isolates from whole Nature grown foods that have been separated from their other constituents and buffers they were bound to. They aren't recognized by the body as food the way whole Nature grown herbs are in that state and therefore at best only "stimulate" and later "enervate" (since every action has an equal and opposite reaction). If certain populations in the world can live on just raw fruit and raw veg without ever experiencing any chronic or degenerative illness or "disease" and live until their mid 100s even 150+, I would think it is safe to say we can live probably more healthfully without man made so called "natural" supplements and instead stay optimally healthy by just eating a species appropriate diet than we can taking those supplements.
Yes. I've seen that chart many times before! It is a keeper! I wish there were other tools like that on the internet to make it obvious to people what we should be eating for optimal health. One like that showing the different GI tracts of mammals and the lengths of the intestines along with their natural optimal diets might be an idea.
Also just showing humans living in different parts of the world with a description of their typical diets and there average age at death and chances of contracting a chronic and degenerative disease might be another. An Eskimo might be one of the pics starting out at the short lifespan end of the spectrum up to the Hunzas and Vilcabambans at the other end of the spectrum with the longest lifespan and showing their diet which of course is the high simple carb raw fruit and veg and very low protein and low fat.
Me either.I never heard of this person. Maybe I have been living under a rock?
