Why do meat-eaters struggle to understand?

[wildr0se2]

So my brother-in-law made a joke about how, in his culture, they eat cats and dogs. I was disturbed by the comment, but kept quiet. I brought it up to my siblings. One sibling said again that it's my brother in law's culture, my other one told me we are omnivores. In general, both didn't understand why I was upset. Sibling 2 tried to use an analogy that it's like when he makes homophobic/transphobic jokes about himself, but that did not make me feel better. I tried to explain that, as a vegan who is navigating things still, we don't HAVE to eat animals. I often get this feeling that omnivores treat veganism is this rare ideology, and I can see why they'd think that, since vegans make up 1-2% of the population, if I'm not mistaken. It just still baffles me how people can continue justifying the suffering of animals. Heck, I still get cravings and feel social pressure to eat like the rest of my family and loved ones. But I can't unsee the horrors from the documentaries, the way we take advantage of these creatures who want to live on this planet too. I even feel mentally gross in the long run when I consume an animal product (whether by accident or having a slip up). For those who are more experienced vegans, do you have any guidance on how to navigate these situations?

 

[Lou]

I try to keep things in perspective. For half my life I wasn't vegan. So it's not THAT hard to remember what it was like when I was a carnist, too.
Dr. Melanie Joy has the BEST writing on this subject. Or you can watch her videos.
one quickie. skip to the 49 minute mark and just listen to her advice. (which makes even more sense if you went thru the whole video or read her writing.

and this short article also helps a lot.

Coping with Non-Vegan Relatives During the Holidays - VEGANTEEN

Dealing and coping with non-vegan relatives during family get-togethers over the holidays.

veganteen.net

 

[Tom L.]

..... I often get this feeling that omnivores treat veganism is this rare ideology, and I can see why they'd think that, since vegans make up 1-2% of the population, if I'm not mistaken. It just still baffles me how people can continue justifying the suffering of animals. Heck, I still get cravings and feel social pressure to eat like the rest of my family and loved ones. .....

I've only quoted part of your post (although all the points you make are good!!!)

I might be wrong, but I get the impression most people don't exactly "justify" the suffering of animals. They just don't think about it. People generally don't consider animal-treatment issues as if they are remotely as important as human rights/welfare issues- and even those issues are not completely resolved, although progress on them has been made. Most of us tend to our own lives first.

I think that one of the amazing things about veganism is: it doesn't take much effort, compared to how much good it does! You just stop consuming/using animals and their bodily secretions, and start eating and drinking other things instead! Once you've made new habits routine, you mostly just coast along.

 

[silva]

I do understand. I think the longer I'm vegan the more I understand.
Humans are opportunistic eaters, meat is a caloric dense food when people needed that to survive. When food production became an massive industry it changed the perception of food from sustenance, to entertainment. People are easily led, and esp. in a capitalistic society the competition to sell products at the highest profit doesn't involve what's best for the consumer, or the ethics of production. Profits are what matters. How little it costs to make, how much it sells for, how easy it is to keep and grow the customer base

As vegans it seems so obvious why we feel as we do. It's the same for most every ethical stance. It isn't that people are willing to contribute to suffering, the vast majority don't want that, but they also don't feel as it's as much or widespread as we make it to be. The same goes for the lives of the disabled, generational poor, minorities, LGBT, mental illness, climate change, undocumented people being disappeared

There is just so much injustice people can be concerned with fighting.
To me, it's more about growing awareness that plant foods are easy, cheap and accomodating to every day meals for everyone.
It breaks me to see people react to posts about vegan recipes that say they aren't vegan, but like to follow vegan recipes and get trashed for not being 100%.
For how I see things, getting people to understand that cooking plant foods can be easier, cheaper and healthier compared to animal products. That our government is controlling the masses by using living being as commodities by subsidizing ranchers and dairies. By keeping the slaughter in poor areas, with immigrant and poor workers.
Food is political.
The more people are removed from killing and prepping animals the less they think about what it means to eat them. Honestly, I've had some of the best discussions with hunters. People who live far closer to nature than I ever could, who care for the animals and their environment more than any vegan I've known. Who go spend that week or two of hunting season often without one shot. One trip I've heard entailed removing a barbed wire fencing someone had put up that trapped a fawn.

I'm vegan because I can be, and just as I would kill someone that would threaten me I would never harm them without provocation.

 

[TrueVegan]

So my brother-in-law made a joke about how, in his culture, they eat cats and dogs. I was disturbed by the comment, but kept quiet. I brought it up to my siblings. One sibling said again that it's my brother in law's culture, my other one told me we are omnivores. In general, both didn't understand why I was upset. Sibling 2 tried to use an analogy that it's like when he makes homophobic/transphobic jokes about himself, but that did not make me feel better. I tried to explain that, as a vegan who is navigating things still, we don't HAVE to eat animals. I often get this feeling that omnivores treat veganism is this rare ideology, and I can see why they'd think that, since vegans make up 1-2% of the population, if I'm not mistaken. It just still baffles me how people can continue justifying the suffering of animals. Heck, I still get cravings and feel social pressure to eat like the rest of my family and loved ones. But I can't unsee the horrors from the documentaries, the way we take advantage of these creatures who want to live on this planet too. I even feel mentally gross in the long run when I consume an animal product (whether by accident or having a slip up). For those who are more experienced vegans, do you have any guidance on how to navigate these situations?

People can justify anything to themselves with enough propaganda. People accepted the Holocaust due to intense propaganda. Until recently, we ate whatever we could get to survive, which resulted in thousands of years of pro meat indoctrination. The only reason people accept the meat industry is due to the fact that they think like sheep, they blindly accept what people around them believe.

 

[Emma JC]

welcome to the forum @TrueVegan - always nice to have a fellow Canadian join in - did you grow up in a vegan family?

Emma JC
Find your vegan soulmate or just a friend. www.spiritualmatchmaking.com

 

[TrueVegan]

welcome to the forum @TrueVegan - always nice to have a fellow Canadian join in - did you grow up in a vegan family?

Emma JC
Find your vegan soulmate or just a friend. www.spiritualmatchmaking.com

I did not, however, my parents are supportive. Here is my full history: at 9, I went vegetarian for a year or so out of concern for animals. However, my parents asked me to eat some meat due to concerns for my health, but I think they tried to be as understanding as possible. At 10, I randomly thought: "what about organic though, animals live well". At 16, I snapped out of it and went vegetarian. At 17, I made the jump and went vegan. At 18, I became more deeply convinced of my beliefs and I began doing activism, which I still do today (19). I convinced my parents to drop their consumption of animal products. How about you? Did you grow up in a vegan family?

 

[Emma JC]

I did not, however, my parents are supportive. Here is my full history: at 9, I went vegetarian for a year or so out of concern for animals. However, my parents asked me to eat some meat due to concerns for my health, but I think they tried to be as understanding as possible. At 10, I randomly thought: "what about organic though, animals live well". At 16, I snapped out of it and went vegetarian. At 17, I made the jump and went vegan. At 18, I became more deeply convinced of my beliefs and I began doing activism, which I still do today (19). I convinced my parents to drop their consumption of animal products. How about you? Did you grow up in a vegan family?

thank you for asking, no I did not and none of my family are either as I didn't go full vegan until 2016 and had flirted with it, on and off, for a few years before that - they are supportive however I do limit my exposure to them as I do limit my exposure to all humans... LOL

Emma JC
Find your vegan soulmate or just a friend. www.spiritualmatchmaking.com

 

[jalan]

So my brother-in-law made a joke about how, in his culture, they eat cats and dogs. I was disturbed by the comment, but kept quiet. I brought it up to my siblings. One sibling said again that it's my brother in law's culture, my other one told me we are omnivores. In general, both didn't understand why I was upset. Sibling 2 tried to use an analogy that it's like when he makes homophobic/transphobic jokes about himself, but that did not make me feel better. I tried to explain that, as a vegan who is navigating things still, we don't HAVE to eat animals. I often get this feeling that omnivores treat veganism is this rare ideology, and I can see why they'd think that, since vegans make up 1-2% of the population, if I'm not mistaken. It just still baffles me how people can continue justifying the suffering of animals. Heck, I still get cravings and feel social pressure to eat like the rest of my family and loved ones. But I can't unsee the horrors from the documentaries, the way we take advantage of these creatures who want to live on this planet too. I even feel mentally gross in the long run when I consume an animal product (whether by accident or having a slip up). For those who are more experienced vegans, do you have any guidance on how to navigate these situations?

It’s a difficult one, as in all cultures we learn from infancy what is considered ‘normal’ and it becomes deeply imbedded in our psyche and very hard to overcome… Most of us want to belong and to have the esteem of others, so the peer pressure is formidable… Myself, I mostly feel on the outer when I refuse the steak on the barbecue; so, I usually bring my own vegan snags. Though I’ve found that the old saying, ‘slowly slowly catchy monkey’ works, generally, that is and you’ll be accepted... I’m afraid that it’s just par for the course you’ve taken… So, what I do is to surround myself with likeminded people, those who share a similar view… take care

 

[juliii]

I’ve had similar moments where I stayed quiet to avoid conflict, but felt deeply unsettled afterward.
You're right: once you’ve seen the reality behind animal exploitation, it changes you. The fact that others treat that awareness like an “ideology” instead of a moral stance can feel invalidating. Especially when they try to rationalize it with cultural or biological arguments, ignoring the ethical side completely.
In situations like this, I’ve found that protecting your peace is key. You don’t always have to argue or educate - sometimes, it’s enough to quietly hold your ground. Connect with people who do share your values, whether online or in local communities, because that support makes a huge difference

 

[ewomack]

People have taken non-human animals for granted for so long that it's hard for some to see them as sentient, feeling, and knowing beings. Adding confirmation bias to the equation, people likely don't want to see non-human animals as moral agents because it quickly makes many things "inconvenient" (i.e., food, clothing, other supplies). Slavery worked on similar principles: dehumanize a subsection of people and moral qualms melted away. It seems difficult for many people to get past this concept. Accepting it would make many modern lives very complicated.

 

[jalan]

Agreed, I’d even suggest that many other species display a degree of ‘sapience’ also…