'Plants are trying to kill you`!-Dr Anthony Chaffee

[Lou]

How does he explain the Blue Zones? And how plant based diets have been around for thousands of years.

You might have to watch the video to find out. If you do, I would like to hear back.

They keep pushing the anti soy and anti plant based when there are literally thousands of years of evidence that it is healthy. The diet of the Okinawans is 60% purple sweet potatoes and they are the longest lived people in the world. 1/3rd of India is vegan. They are healthy.

I guess/bet that he just ignores whatever facts don't support his premise.

I think as far as veganism goes we really don't need to worry about these carnivore/paleo types and their ilk. It's just a distraction from veganism's core message of compassion to others. Absolutely nothing to do with diet.

I would not go that far. Even the most ethically based of us are concerned with our diets. If only because if we would not be good role models if we die young.

I feel sorry for those who get sucked in to it all, especially carnivore. At face value there do seem to be some short term health benefits for a few people. But some equally worrying short term health issues as well. No-one really knows long term.

There may not even be short term health benefits. Although low carb types do initially lose weight.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/12/27/health/low-carb-weight-loss-over-time-wellness/index.html

And we do have some good indications if not evidence for long term health issues.
See Blue Zones study, the China Study, and others.

 

[silva]

I think as far as veganism goes we really don't need to worry about these carnivore/paleo types and their ilk. It's just a distraction from veganism's core message of compassion to others. Absolutely nothing to do with diet.

If I wasn't convinced eating a plant only diet wasn't the healthiest for humans I would not be vegan
How the heck can you want to convince everyone to eat a sub par diet that most don't even want to eat?

 

[Lou]

If I wasn't convinced eating a plant only diet wasn't the healthiest for humans I would not be vegan
How the heck can you want to convince everyone to eat a sub par diet that most don't even want to eat?

CNN just ran an article on the best diet. As usual the Mediterranean style diet got first place. I think they give points for ease of keeping -and I can see why the vegan diet would lose points in that area.
DASH and MIND got first and second - and all the top three are basically plant based.

Vegan diet won 10th place.
Paleo came in 20th
Keto came in 25th. But won in the fast weight loss category.
Raw came in 30th - last place.

https://www.cnn.com/2024/01/03/health/best-diet-2024-wellness/index.html

 

[silva]

CNN just ran an article on the best diet. As usual the Mediterranean style diet got first place. I think they give points for ease of keeping -and I can see why the vegan diet would lose points in that area.
DASH and MIND got first and second - and all the top three are basically plant based.

Vegan diet won 10th place.
Paleo came in 20th
Keto came in 25th. But won in the fast weight loss category.
Raw came in 30th - last place.

https://www.cnn.com/2024/01/03/health/best-diet-2024-wellness/index.html

Ugh...... The vegan diet came in third in the plant based diet catagory--following the flexitarian and Mediterranean diets

 

[Rohan]

If I wasn't convinced eating a plant only diet wasn't the healthiest for humans I would not be vegan

Interesting. So if it was proven eating some meat as well was more healthy than PB you would quit veganism?

How the heck can you want to convince everyone to eat a sub par diet that most don't even want to eat?

Because it's not about the diet.

 

[Rohan]

I would not go that far. Even the most ethically based of us are concerned with our diets. If only because if we would not be good role models if we die young.

Oh sure. Don't get me wrong. I think being vegan you have to take an interest in the diet, especially for health reasons.

But I stand by my premise that the decision to become vegan can never be motivated by concerns with health.

 

[silva]

If I wasn't convinced eating a plant only diet wasn't the healthiest for humans I would not be vegan
How the heck can you want to convince everyone to eat a sub par diet that most don't even want to eat?

Interesting. So if it was proven eating some meat as well was more healthy than PB you would quit veganism?

Because it's not about the diet.

Plant based diets have been proven to be healthier. I've been a junk food vegan long enough to know it's still better than being a junk food omni!
Honestly, I don't call myself vegan because while I avoid animal products outside of foods, I will buy second hand leather if I feel it's the best choice. Examples are my old car with leather seats--I great find in my low price range. I could not have afforded a decent car if I limited choices to things outside of running condition. My foot and ankle brace--only option was leather. I really hate the idea of being vegan for personal purity

And speaking of personal purity--if you insist on using emotion as the basis for being vegan, how can face the reality of the continued breeding and slaughter?
People eat what they want, what they need, what they can afford and prepare in the same manner they grew up with. There is only reason the vast majority try and change is when they feel something is wrong with all of the above. They have a hard enough time eating to improve their own health much less the animals. A hard enough time buying food they can afford without their family complaining. What I'm getting at here, is I don't care why people quit eating , or eating and using as much animal products, I care about continuing on a path to normalize plant foods over animal foods. Most everyone I know has seen documentaries like Dominion or Earthlings. I've only known a couple of those who had any inclination to eat vegan. I know far more people who have had doctors suggest quitting dairy and less meat and have seen their health improve
Animals do not care why they're not hurt. They really aren't the cute memes we make of them. They just want to live their own lives in their own habitats.
Just as I really dislike many people, I would want to harm or have harm caused them. If I needed to protect myself or my belongings, I would harm, or have harm caused.

 

[silva]

@Brian W l have often argued with you about this very subject, but I believe I feel the same. It becomes more apparent when I'm confronted with real life situations. I appreciate you and others who are willing to share their views

 

[Rohan]

Plant based diets have been proven to be healthier.

Yes I agree. But to try and stay focused on the hypothetical point I'm making, if omni was proven to be more healthy, you'd start eating meat again, correct?

if you insist on using emotion as the basis for being vegan

Where did I use emotion? I'm simply stating that choosing to go vegan is 100% about animal rights. Not your health. Thankfully it's a very healthy diet as well

 

[Rohan]

I really hate the idea of being vegan for personal purity

So now you're talking about what others may refer to as 'virtue signalling' ... to be clear, my own personal purity has nothing to do with my choice to be vegan. My motivation is selfless and I don't want to be responsible for animal suffering so my choice is to reject animal products. That way I don't create the demand.

Pure pragmatism.

 

[Brian W]

I am not fond of the idea of being a role model. That's just far too much responsibility. I am doing my bit by not contributing to the slaughter as far as I am concerned. I am glad a plant based diet is healthier though as my ideal would be to pass into the next life with minimum suffering.

@silva - I appreciate your views too. I have stomped my feet at times but I always come back with appreciation!

 

[Lou]

Yes I agree. But to try and stay focused on the hypothetical point I'm making, if omni was proven to be more healthy, you'd start eating meat again, correct?

not sure. It depends. Would have to think about it.

 

[Lou]

I am not fond of the idea of being a role model.

Regardless, for everyone who knows you are vegan you are a role model.
Either a shining example or a horrible warning.
In fact trying to be "the shining example" is maybe the most personal type of activism.

 

[Lou]

So now you're talking about what others may refer to as 'virtue signalling' ...

not sure that personal purity is the same as virtue signaling.
My take on it is that in the vegan sphere, personal purity is the guy who is overly concerned with ingredients, and/or contamination.

 

[Sax]

Veganism doesn't have to be the healthiest of all possible diets. I feel like this is one of those unreasonable standards carnists demand of us and too many vegans have fallen for it.

If you put up the healthiest possible vegan diet and the healthiest possible diet with animal products head to head I think we'd find a very small difference between the two. Maybe you could eek out a tiny bit more athletic performance, or lower your risk of chronic illness a fraction of a percent, by including some animal products. I don't know if that's true or not but it's entirely possible and we should be able to admit that and pivot away from nutritional nitpicking to focus the discussion where it belongs: the mass violence inflicted on individuals to create animal products.

We all fall short of whatever we think the optimum diet is. Anyone saying veganism isn't the perfect diet is guaranteed to be deviating from their own idea of perfection - drinking beer, enjoying too many sweets, eating processed food for the sake of convenience or pleasure. It's a disingenuous argument. They care so much about their nutrition that we have to perpetuate the most violent thing in human history, but not enough to stop eating pizza?

It's a huge distraction, and part of the folly of trying to achieve systemic change through individual change.

 

[silva]

Yes I agree. But to try and stay focused on the hypothetical point I'm making, if omni was proven to be more healthy, you'd start eating meat again, correct?


Where did I use emotion? I'm simply stating that choosing to go vegan is 100% about animal rights. Not your health. Thankfully it's a very healthy diet as well

If I had known there were things missing from a plant based diet that would require more than the simplicity of b12, like if we were obligate carnivours, I would likely incorporate some meat.

I first went veg based on ethics and pragmatism. Breeding and killing animals made zero sense. It was like my worst nightmares.
And I did use the term emotions rather than ethics because I do hear vegans say they would stay vegan even if it did put their health in jeopardy. To me that's not being ethical, it's emotional. No sickly vegan is going to win anyone over, but it were true that having some animal whatever would bring you back to health simply being realistic and advocating a flexitarian diet, and animal welfare, would exponentially help animals

 

[Brian W]

Regardless, for everyone who knows you are vegan you are a role model.
Either a shining example or a horrible warning.
In fact trying to be "the shining example" is maybe the most personal type of activism.

If vegan is good then it is good, I shouldn't need to try. In fact trying is a form of deception. Who wants to spend their whole life trying and never relaxing and enjoying?

 

[Lou]

If vegan is good then it is good, I shouldn't need to try. In fact trying is a form of deception. Who wants to spend their whole life trying and never relaxing and enjoying?

I am half way sure that you are joking.... but only half way.

Of course you have to try. Heck the word strive is in the definition. You don't just fall out of bed and become vegan

Wait, you are a Conscientious Christian, does that mean your are immune to temptation?

 

[VeganRachel]

Whats sadly most hilarious about this is everyones claim that eating plants are bad because they have things in them that can potetially harm you while ignoring the reality that animals can and will kill you. If they don't, the parasites and bacteria in them will.
The other irony is the commenters keep saying you need to do the opposite of what they tell you--as if plant based diets aren't the opposite of whats pushed isn't enough!

I think it was a dr Phil show that featured both people on plant based diets with their doctors as well as carnivours. Even Dr Phil and his team were willing to admit plant based diets had merit and condemned just eating meat.

You can find anything to agree with you if you look hard enough. I'm still waiting for those space lasers to do their whammy on the vaccinated

Hi, if you are supporting covid jabs, please be aware of the mutliple studies out that reveal huge tendencies to form blood clots,
myocarditis, and other health problems. Many pro athletes who got their covid jabs have had to stop their careers.

 

[VeganRachel]

How should this lecture be evaluated:

Hi there. There are a myriad of "diets" today for humans, and eating only dead animals is one of them. And yes, veganism is not a diet
it is a lifestyle involving compassion and empathy as well.
The low carbers and carni's are truly AFRAID of plants, low carbers in particular are AFRAID of even healthy carbohydrates (sweet potatoes,
carrots, green beans, whole grains (quinoa, brown rice, millet, whole wheat, rye, etcetera), beans, and many more. They fear the carbophydrates,
the often discussed "anti" nutrients ( phytates, oxalates, etcetera) in foods of plant origen. So, they instead focus on animal proteins (red meat,
chickens, pigs, fish, bison---basically almost any dead animal, eggs, dairy) fats, and if any, low carb vegetables. Some of these humans have
allergies, as shown by their statements of all of their health problems disappearing when they just ate cadavers instead.
Were they consuming non-organic processed foods, gmo-laden foods, glyphosate containing foods and THOSE were the true cause of
their problems?. Were they extremely sensitive to "anti" nutrients?. I cannot say, but it could be.
Lets also mention Paul SALADino, M.D. who raved and obsessed about eating the "cave-man" nose to tail diet of the dead
animals. He has many followers and certainly made Million$ by doing this promotion. Many humans also verbally refuted what
he promotes and told him he was headed for health problems. HE did not agree. YET, two years ago, he must have had some
huge health problems (constant consipation among them) and malnutrition, as he added WHITE RICE and FRUITS to his lion diet.

ALL of these promoters of low carb, or, eating only the dead, believe what they are saying. I believe they are acting out of fear.
Perhaps the dead-eaters are also acting out of low self-esteeem, and eating only animals make them feel powerful, manly,
dominant, ancient, or some other psychological terms.
Yet, veganism is not based in FEAR. It is based in compassion for all animals, the environment, and human health. It to me
is based in LOVE overall. I have no need to be superior to any other humans, thats' not my focus. Thank you to all, love, rachel