Obamacare

[rainforests1]

http://www.counterpunch.org/2013/02/05/obamacare-a-deception/
According to this article, corporations will benefit from Obamacare while millions of ordinary Americans will suffer. If true, this is likely to hurt the Democratic party. I have no idea why Democrats would agree to this. On the other hand, Counterpunch is a Liberal news source, so they must have reason to believe this is true. Do you think this is true?

 

[Scorpius]

That site looks wicked legit.

 

[rainforests1]

That site looks wicked legit.

From articles I've read they criticize Obama over drones and his violations of the Constitution. I don't notice them posting conspiracy theories at all. I think it is legitimate.

 

[ledboots]

Well AARP stands to make a billion from Obamacare.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/aroy/20...s-for-supporting-obamacares-cuts-to-medicare/

 

[beancounter]

http://www.counterpunch.org/2013/02/05/obamacare-a-deception/
According to this article, corporations will benefit from Obamacare while millions of ordinary Americans will suffer. If true, this is likely to hurt the Democratic party. I have no idea why Democrats would agree to this. On the other hand, Counterpunch is a Liberal news source, so they must have reason to believe this is true. Do you think this is true?

Obama is a politician. He serves corporate masters, just like the Republicans do.

 

[Eleven]

http://www.counterpunch.org/2013/02/05/obamacare-a-deception/
According to this article, corporations will benefit from Obamacare while millions of ordinary Americans will suffer. If true, this is likely to hurt the Democratic party. I have no idea why Democrats would agree to this. On the other hand, Counterpunch is a Liberal news source, so they must have reason to believe this is true. Do you think this is true?

Liberal news source?

The author, Paul Craig Roberts, was Assistant Secretary of the Treasury in the Reagan Administration and is credited as a co-founder of Reaganomics. He's also a former associate editor of the Wall Street Journal and Business Week.

 

[Amy SF]

I don't pay any attention to doom 'n gloom predictions of what will happen when Obamacare takes full effect. All I care about is if it allows people like me who currently don't have any health insurance to get insurance, then I'm for it. It may not be perfect, but Obama obviously couldn't get the health insurance reform he really wanted (single payer), so this is what we got instead. If it doesn't make liberals happy, it's because the Republicans in Congress tried to kill it, and when they couldn't, they forced Obama to water it down considerably.

 

[rainforests1]

Liberal news source?

The author, Paul Craig Roberts, was Assistant Secretary of the Treasury in the Reagan Administration and is credited as a co-founder of Reaganomics. He's also a former associate editor of the Wall Street Journal and Business Week.

Most of the writers who write the articles are Democrat, according to Wikipedia. If it's not Liberal, it's certainly not Conservative.

 

[rainforests1]

I don't pay any attention to doom 'n gloom predictions of what will happen when Obamacare takes full effect. All I care about is if it allows people like me who currently don't have any health insurance to get insurance, then I'm for it. It may not be perfect, but Obama obviously couldn't get the health insurance reform he really wanted (single payer), so this is what we got instead. If it doesn't make liberals happy, it's because the Republicans in Congress tried to kill it, and when they couldn't, they forced Obama to water it down considerably.

Obama lies a lot, so we have no idea what his real intentions were. It was mostly Democrats that passed Obamacare through the Congress. If 2014 comes and millions of Americans are all of a sudden paying a lot more money for their insurance, they'll blame it on Obamacare. The Democrats will get blamed and rightfully so. The Republicans can get blamed on a lot of things, but this isn't one of them.

 

[ledboots]

This has some info.
http://jama.jamanetwork.com/article.aspx?articleid=1487506

 

[das_nut]

That site looks wicked legit.

It sounds legit as well. It uses a silver plan for its calculations, not the bronze plan, even though the bronze plan is cheaper.

 

[Spang]

Paul Craig Roberts, the author of the article, has been critical of George W. Bush, the War on Drugs, the War on Terror, Israel, the media (to include right-wing talk radio), and the drone killing of American Anwar al-Awlaki, to name a few. Mr. Roberts is a credible source in my opinion.

 

[Spang]

Also, it's not surprising that a major piece of legislation greatly benefits corporations. That's pretty much par for the course.

 

[ledboots]

It sounds legit as well. It uses a silver plan for its calculations, not the bronze plan, even though the bronze plan is cheaper.

The bronze plan only pays 60% of costs. It is a terrible plan.

 

[ledboots]

..."What are they so afraid of? The whole house of cards collapsing, just as soon as people catch on that the penalties tax for not following the mandate tax are much smaller than buying insurance.

How much smaller? Way smaller: Bronze will be the lowest tier health-insurance plan available under Obamacare–after Silver, Gold, and Platinum. Under the law, the penalty for not buying health insurance is supposed to be capped at either the annual average Bronze premium, 2.5 percent of taxable income, or $2,085.00 per family in 2016.

That’s from a CNS report on just how much the IRS estimates insurance will cost a family of five as soon as 2016:In a final regulation issued Wednesday, the Internal Revenue Service (IRS) assumed that under Obamacare the cheapest health insurance plan available in 2016 for a family will cost $20,000 for the year.That’s the Bronze plan. The cheapskate plan. How much will Silver and Gold cost?

Well, if you have to ask…But why bother asking? You can pay $20,000 up front, or shell out a couple grand at the end of the year. And if you get sick? Insurers can no longer deny you for having a preexisting condition, even if it’s something you were diagnosed with, say, earlier this morning.If you think there might be a few people willing to game that system, my buddy John Nolte is way out ahead of you.

Even millionaires and billionaires are having trouble scraping up enough cash to pay for ObamaCare’s many taxes and fees, as evidenced by Smith & Nephew: A global medical technology company has laid off nearly 100 employees at its offices in Tennessee and Massachusetts and is blaming the layoffs on the medical device tax tied to ObamaCare.. http://pjmedia.com/tatler/2013/02/01/how-to-ruin-healthcare-in-just-2000-easy-pages/

 

[ledboots]

I don't pay any attention to doom 'n gloom predictions of what will happen when Obamacare takes full effect. All I care about is if it allows people like me who currently don't have any health insurance to get insurance, then I'm for it. It may not be perfect, but Obama obviously couldn't get the health insurance reform he really wanted (single payer), so this is what we got instead. If it doesn't make liberals happy, it's because the Republicans in Congress tried to kill it, and when they couldn't, they forced Obama to water it down considerably.

You won't be able to make the choice not to have insurance anymore, or you will have to pay thousands in IRS penalties.

 

[beancounter]

You won't be able to make the choice not to have insurance anymore, or you will have to pay thousands in IRS penalties.

IMO, people who choose not to buy insurance * (health, home owners, life, etc), are putting their (and their families) financial wellbeing at risk.

*seperate and distinct from those who can't afford it

 

[ledboots]

IMO, people who choose not to buy insurance * (health, home owners, life, etc), are putting their (and their families) financial wellbeing at risk.

*seperate and distinct from those who can't afford it

A lot of young healthy people don't buy health insurance, or just buy catostrophic coverage. Risky, and I don't recommend it by any means, but it is done.

 

[mlp]

That’s from a CNS report on just how much the IRS estimates insurance will cost a family of five as soon as 2016:In a final regulation issued Wednesday, the Internal Revenue Service (IRS) assumed that under Obamacare the cheapest health insurance plan available in 2016 for a family will cost $20,000 for the year.That’s the Bronze plan. The cheapskate plan. How much will Silver and Gold cost?

Well, as of seven years ago, when I last priced what major medical, with the highest deductibles and co-pays available, would cost me, it was just under $5,000 per month for myself alone. And the only way that was even available for me was because of HIPAA. Since I couldn't afford that at that time, I have since been uninsurable, solely because I have a history of depression (on AD's for years, but never hospitalized), and even though I am physically about as healthy a 56 year old as you're ever likely to meet.

Compared to just under $60,000 a year for one individual, $20,000 for a family of four seems like a bargain.

Even millionaires and billionaires are having trouble scraping up enough cash to pay for ObamaCare’s many taxes and fees, as evidenced by Smith & Nephew: A global medical technology company has laid off nearly 100 employees at its offices in Tennessee and Massachusetts and is blaming the layoffs on the medical device tax tied to ObamaCare.. http://pjmedia.com/tatler/2013/02/01/how-to-ruin-healthcare-in-just-2000-easy-pages/

Of course they blame the health care act, because it's contrary to their interests to have it in place. The medical device industry, as of 2009, was the fourth most profitable industry in the U.S.

There's a reason why the U.S. spends so much more on healthcare per individual than countries with much better healthcare outcomes - there are huge profits flowing into multiple industries.

But good on you for sticking up for those poor cash strapped millionaires and billionaires - if you didn't, who would?

 

[mlp]

A lot of young healthy people don't buy health insurance, or just buy catostrophic coverage. Risky, and I don't recommend it by any means, but it is done.

Do you understand the reasons why the young and the healthy can't be allowed to opt out if coverage is to be provided to those with pre-existing conditions?