No, Its Really NOT About You Being a "Nicer" Vegan

Forest Nymph

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Psychology article states hatred of vegans in America is at least as strong as towards immigrants, and even more so than racism against Blacks.

Root causes include perception of someone who is different being a threat to society, internal conflicts in self when reminded meat comes from animals, and feelings of disgust when thinking about where meat comes from.

Vegetarians are targeted too, but vegans more so.


 
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SapphireLightning

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Just reinforces my need to buy some land and start a vegan commune. Just gotta bide my time, in 3-ish years I should have enough freedom-dollars to do just that without involving a bank.

But seriously, are people that pathetic that someone "being different" and being reminded of one's own reality really trigger hoomans like this?
 

shyvas

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Just reinforces my need to buy some land and start a vegan commune. Just gotta bide my time, in 3-ish years I should have enough freedom-dollars to do just that without involving a bank.

But seriously, are people that pathetic that someone "being different" and being reminded of one's own reality really trigger hoomans like this?
I'd love to join us as long as there are plenty of animals in your ideal Vegan land. :grinning:
 

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Psychology article states hatred of vegans in America is at least as strong as towards immigrants, and even more so than racism against Blacks.

Root causes include perception of someone who is different being a threat to society, internal conflicts in self when reminded meat comes from animals, and feelings of disgust when thinking about where meat comes from.

Vegetarians are targeted too, but vegans more so.


Eh, I would suggest that these are contributing causes, though not primary ones, except for the first:

"someone who is different being a threat to society"

and not simply because they are different. Vegetarians are "different" than omnivores, but seem to garner less hatred. So are pescatarians and even flexitarians. Hindus and Buddhists depart from the majority also if they are in a western culture, at least insofar as they practice religion (or don't practice majority religion as the case may be).

None of these groups however is a burgeoning movement that gets a lot of press for disruption though, such as some vegans get when they protest while blocking streets and traffic, storm animal ag farms, or even in front of small/family businesses. These actions can win converts as well as grow hatred and enemies.
 

Bob Who

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Why are vegans referred to as Veg*ns ???

The example used in the article reminds me of a time during the mid '70's when bumper stickers reading " I Found It " were seen on the cars of born again or evangelical christians. A friend of mine decided his car would sport a sticker proclaiming " I Lost It ". It was almost a weekly occurance that he would return to his car to find someone had damaged something. It was a kinder time, now he'd probably incur a more violent reaction. A drawback to proclaiming one's philosophy on a bumper sticker.

I live in the US and my perception is that more and more intolerance and tribalism is not only openly evident, but more socially acceptable, and growing. I think it has a lot to do with the right wing conservative agenda that pretty much boils down to pack behavior, selfishness-- I belong to this group, this is what we want everyone else is the enemy.
 

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Thank You for that explanation Andy.
 
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Lou

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Here is another article about the same thing but from a bit of a different perspective. I'm trying to figure out why these two articles came out within a few days of each other.

 

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Here is another article about the same thing but from a bit of a different perspective. I'm trying to figure out why these two articles came out within a few days of each other.

Propaganda?
 

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Propaganda?
I didn't think so. I've only recently become aware of The Guardian, as it appears occasionally in my newsfeed. It does have a "stated political agenda":

This is our pledge: we will continue to give global heating, wildlife extinction and pollution the urgent attention and prominence they demand. The Guardian recognizes the climate emergency as the defining issue of our times.​

The article concludes that meat causes climate change and health issues.

One of the things I liked about the article was all the references to relevant historial and current events.
 
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Forest Nymph

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Eh, I would suggest that these are contributing causes, though not primary ones, except for the first:

"someone who is different being a threat to society"

and not simply because they are different. Vegetarians are "different" than omnivores, but seem to garner less hatred. So are pescatarians and even flexitarians. Hindus and Buddhists depart from the majority also if they are in a western culture, at least insofar as they practice religion (or don't practice majority religion as the case may be).

None of these groups however is a burgeoning movement that gets a lot of press for disruption though, such as some vegans get when they protest while blocking streets and traffic, storm animal ag farms, or even in front of small/family businesses. These actions can win converts as well as grow hatred and enemies.
They are the primary ones. A mother who has some bumper stickers on her car doesn't get run off the damn road or have things thrown at her because of protests. A lot of groups protest, including gay Pride, Black Lives Matter, students protesting climate change and people who unequivocally hate Donald Trump.

There are militant activists in any social justice group, and their presence online or in a major city doesn't make ramdoms bully other children or run mothers off the road.

It's perfectly obvious that this is like when slave owners felt entitled to slaves and when men felt entitled to own women. It's threatening an entitled power structure to simply exist.
 
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Forest Nymph

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Why are vegans referred to as Veg*ns ???

The example used in the article reminds me of a time during the mid '70's when bumper stickers reading " I Found It " were seen on the cars of born again or evangelical christians. A friend of mine decided his car would sport a sticker proclaiming " I Lost It ". It was almost a weekly occurance that he would return to his car to find someone had damaged something. It was a kinder time, now he'd probably incur a more violent reaction. A drawback to proclaiming one's philosophy on a bumper sticker.

I live in the US and my perception is that more and more intolerance and tribalism is not only openly evident, but more socially acceptable, and growing. I think it has a lot to do with the right wing conservative agenda that pretty much boils down to pack behavior, selfishness-- I belong to this group, this is what we want everyone else is the enemy.
Veg*ns is a catch all term that includes vegetarians too.
 

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They are the primary ones. A mother who has some bumper stickers on her car doesn't get run off the damn road or have things thrown at her because of protests. A lot of groups protest, including gay Pride, Black Lives Matter, students protesting climate change and people who unequivocally hate Donald Trump.

There are militant activists in any social justice group, and their presence online or in a major city doesn't make ramdoms bully other children or run mothers off the road.
I am amused at the omniscience assumed in this statement. I am glad there are people so gifted to assume with great accuracy the motives of individuals and how any of them will or won't act to a given circumstance or stimuli.
 
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Forest Nymph

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Here is another article about the same thing but from a bit of a different perspective. I'm trying to figure out why these two articles came out within a few days of each other.

Propaganda?
The Guardian is almost comically biased and this was apparent with other issues during the Obama administration... however it's not biased enough that I would call it "propaganda." The Guardian is no more biased than any other journalistic publication like the New York Times or the LA Times.

I think they were fair, they actually ended with the sentence that the public is afraid that the worst thing vegans are is "right" about a wasteful majority with an unsustainable lifestyle. I honestly don't find their conclusions all that different from the other article, it seems that the driving motivator for hatred is fear of change to the status quo.

I think they were uneducated though about what vegan means because they called health issues valid, when in reality, this only comes in to play with certain kinds of plant based diets and is objectively not any more life threatening than the standard Western diet.

They also stated worries that we are replacing one industrial system with another, but this is what is often called "concern trolling." It's an objection or biased framed in the manner of social concern (thus concern troll) that in reality is of much less concern than the alternative. In a vegan, even vegetarian, world we would use so much less land and water, and reduce emissions so dramatically, climate change would be halted or even reversed (environmental damage from cattle ranching is documented as far back as the 1500s) so this is just....lame.

It's pretty good for a mainstream article overall. I've seen a Guardian reporter refer to Joey Carbstrong as "aggressive." This is fine in comparison.
 

Forest Nymph

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I didn't think so. I've only recently become aware of The Guardian, as it appears occasionally in my newsfeed. It does have a "stated political agenda":

This is our pledge: we will continue to give global heating, wildlife extinction and pollution the urgent attention and prominence they demand. The Guardian recognizes the climate emergency as the defining issue of our times.​

The article concludes that meat causes climate change and health issues.

One of the things I liked about the article was all the references to relevant historial and current events.
I agree that its not propaganda and that it ends with climate change, but the Guardian is not completely unbiased that is impossible in journalism as a whole since journalists are people and publications have a target audience, and the Guardian has been biased about a variety of things in the past.
 

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They are the primary ones. A mother who has some bumper stickers on her car doesn't get run off the damn road or have things thrown at her because of protests. A lot of groups protest, including gay Pride, Black Lives Matter, students protesting climate change and people who unequivocally hate Donald Trump.

There are militant activists in any social justice group, and their presence online or in a major city doesn't make ramdoms bully other children or run mothers off the road.

It's perfectly obvious that this is like when slave owners felt entitled to slaves and when men felt entitled to own women. It's threatening an entitled power structure to simply exist.
From your post, I assume you're white? Because you sure do have a limited perspective on what it is to live the life of a racial, ethnic, or religious minority in the U.S.

Trust me, everything that a vegan has experienced has been experienced by other minorities, at exponential rates. For example, being tied behind a pickup and dragged until your body disintegrates into pieces. Being beaten to death.

ETA: Also, please open your eyes and read what has been done to Black Lives Matter protesters (for just one example). A protest that I attended a year ago ended up with some people so badly beaten that they have permanent injuries, including one undercover cop.

I really can't understand how you can be so blind to the world around you.
 
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Forest Nymph

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From your post, I assume you're white? Because you sure do have a limited perspective on what it is to live the life of a racial, ethnic, or religious minority in the U.S.

Trust me, everything that a vegan has experienced has been experienced by other minorities, at exponential rates. For example, being tied behind a pickup and dragged until your body disintegrates into pieces. Being beaten to death.

ETA: Also, please open your eyes and read what has been done to Black Lives Matter protesters (for just one example). A protest that I attended a year ago ended up with some people so badly beaten that they have permanent injuries, including one undercover cop.

I really can't understand how you can be so blind to the world around you.
Nobody ever said that these things don't happen to racial minorities. This article is about vegans and vegetarians, not race. Everything in life is not about race. Yesterday former president Obama talked about this idiotic "woke shaming" in his speech yesterday and talked about how ineffective it is.

Besides this article states vegans are currently hated as much as immigrants and more than Blacks in America.
 
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Forest Nymph

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Animal rights activists - some of them - turn some (not all) public opinion negatively towards vegans (or "plant based", strict vegetarian, whatever you prefer that fits your personal convictions), and what is "readily apparent" to me from many many anti-vegan comments I have read is that the brunt of their hate is towards activists - specifically the pushy kind that cause disruptions - rather than on the peaceful abstainers who simply choose to not participate in the needless taking of animal life.

I know you're big on militant activism, which you have made apparent throughout your years here. For the sake of karma I hope the results of that reflect back on you only, and not on peaceful abstainers who may have to bear the brunt of your militarism simply by association.
You don't care about animal rights and wish activists would stop so your meat eating friends will stop judging your plant based diet. I don't care, this isn't about you.
 
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