Freaking Weird Israel Post Tweets

[Second Summer]

Would you punish the children for the actions of the parent/grandparent in any other situation? If you still say yes, and you live in the U.S,. then you need to pack your bags and leave, because your ancestors took the country from the Native Americans.

(What if you're a Native American who live in the U.S.?)

So because European settlers took the land away from Native Americans, today's Americans can't oppose the institutionalised racism in Israel, the "Jewish State"? Can't call for fairness for the millions of displaced Palestinians and their descendants living in refugee camps? Native Americans are at least citizens of the US and have the same rights as any other citizen.

 

[beancounter]

(What if you're a Native American who live in the U.S.?)

So because European settlers took the land away from Native Americans, today's Americans can't oppose the institutionalised racism in Israel, the "Jewish State"? Can't call for fairness for the millions of displaced Palestinians and their descendants living in refugee camps? Native Americans are at least citizens of the US and have the same rights as any other citizen.

My post was directed at those who want to see the dissolution of Israel. The things you mentioned are a separate issue.

 

[mlp]

Native Americans are at least citizens of the US and have the same rights as any other citizen.

Not really. This is only one example of what's still going on: http://stream.aljazeera.com/story/justice-denied-native-american-women-0022344

 

[FortyTwo]

I'm making less of a comment on the political state than saying that this lady is effing nuts.

The death of people matters much more than pets freaking out. Don't take that as a statement of inequality between people and animals, because if it were people complaining about the noise, it'd still be just as much less of a story than the people who are dying.

 

[mlp]

I'm making less of a comment on the political state than saying that this lady is effing nuts.

The death of people matters much more than pets freaking out. Don't take that as a statement of inequality between people and animals, because if it were people complaining about the noise, it'd still be just as much less of a story than the people who are dying.

I don't think anyone has said that it's just as much of a story as people dying.

These types of "human interest" stories are not uncommon. In the immediate aftermath of 9/11, there were stories about how traumatized people on the west coast were, there were stories about small businesses going out of business, there were stories about the travails of people having to walk home to New Jersey, etc. News coverage (and we're talking major networks here) was by no means limited to those who died.

 

[FortyTwo]

I don't think anyone has said that it's just as much of a story as people dying.

These types of "human interest" stories are not uncommon. In the immediate aftermath of 9/11, there were stories about how traumatized people on the west coast were, there were stories about small businesses going out of business, there were stories about the travails of people having to walk home to New Jersey, etc. News coverage (and we're talking major networks here) was by no means limited to those who died.

But the fact that she just outright ignores what they are saying about people dying, preferring to shift it back to the pets topic?

 

[Second Summer]

My post was directed at those who want to see the dissolution of Israel. The things you mentioned are a separate issue.

No, it's related. I'd like to see the dissolution of Israel as a ethnicity-based state that favours citizens of one ethnicity over all the others.

 

[ledboots]

No, it's related. I'd like to see the dissolution of Israel as a ethnicity-based state that favours citizens of one ethnicity over all the others.

And the current citizens of that country would do what?

 

[Second Summer]

And the current citizens of that country would do what?

Not only citizens (obviously not all citizens), it's institutionalized and part of the fabric of the state.

 

[ledboots]

I don't agree with a lot of countries' governments treatment of their people, religious rules in government, etc. I can't just wish the countries away, though, they are full of real people just like me.

 

[ledboots]

Never mind, I decided not to talk about this.

 

[beancounter]

No, it's related. I'd like to see the dissolution of Israel as a ethnicity-based state that favours citizens of one ethnicity over all the others.

But why just target Israel? All of the countries in the Middle East are ethnicity based.

Heck, they even kill each other over sub-ethnicity (e.g. Sunni vs Shiite)

And what about the religion-based discrimination in the Middle East - Muslim vs. everyone else. Certainly the various Arab states favor Islam over Judaism or Christianity. If we followed you logic to its conclusion, then all of them should be dissolved.

 

[Second Summer]

But why just target Israel?

Because the Israeli issues are the causes of so much misery. Because these issues are causes for polarisation, extremism and hinders democratic development in the entire region. And unlike many other ME nations, Israel claims to be a democracy.

All of the countries in the Middle East are ethnicity based.

I beg to differ.

(I'll try to address the rest of your post at a later time.)

 

[mlp]

Because the Israeli issues are the causes of so much misery. Because these issues are causes for polarisation, extremism and hinders democratic development in the entire region. And unlike many other ME nations, Israel claims to be a democracy.

You really think that if Israel ceased to exist, the Middle East would be all sunshine and light? Wow.

I guess India and/or Pakistan should also be dissolved. And South Africa should have been done away with as a nation many decades ago.

Gosh, we're going to have to find new places for many, many millions of people. Or maybe it would be easier to get it over and simply exterminate them.

 

[beancounter]

Because the Israeli issues are the causes of so much misery. Because these issues are causes for polarisation, extremism and hinders democratic development in the entire region.

There is a lot of Muslim on Muslim violence in the Middle East that results polarization and extremism that has nothing to do with Israel. And honestly, I don't think the Middle East is "set up" for Democracy. It's just not part of the culture there, with or without Israel.

 

[mlp]

There is a lot of Muslim on Muslim violence in the Middle East that results polarization and extremism that has nothing to do with Israel. And honestly, I don't think the Middle East is "set up" for Democracy. It's just not part of the culture there, with or without Israel.

I don't know whether or not the ME isset up for democracy - I do think that it has to come, if it comes, at its own rate and in its own way, and I think the presence or the absence of Israel has **** all to do with it. If anything, the presence of Israel gives people a target to hate that keeps them from focusing on the ancient tribal/ethnic hatreds that would otherwise be even more at the forefront.

Those ancient tribal/ethnic hatreds are powerful, and are generally held in check only by the presence of a strong totalitarian regime or the existence of a common enemy. Look at the former Yugoslavia, Iraq, many areas of Africa for examples of what happens when the totalitarian regime or the common enemy is removed. Hell, look at India once the froot of GB was removed from its neck - the only reason mass ethnic slaughter was avoided was because of Gandhi and the partition into two nations - two nations which are still a tinderbox in the region.

 

[Second Summer]

Not really. This is only one example of what's still going on: http://stream.aljazeera.com/story/justice-denied-native-american-women-0022344

I don't want to trivialize the problems faced by Native Americans w.r.t. U.S. laws and law enforcement. But let's agree that it would be worse if they lived in refugee camps in Canada or Russia and were denied citizenship to the new state now on their land, and were not even allowed to go back just to visit.

 

[cornsail]

Some scattered thoughts...

-I don't mind someone doing a story on pets freaking out as long as the other stuff is covered as well.

-Settlements are still ongoing and occupation-of/warfare-against non Isreali citizens is still ongoing, so this is not about 1948.

-I don't want Isreal to be disolved, whatever that means. I want Isrealis and Palestinians to both have statehood.

-I support justice for Native Americans. The situation here is different, because Native Americans aren't plagued by bombs, bulldozers, lack of freedom of travel, restrictions on importation, military checkpoints, etc. But I do support enforcing any recently broken contracts and maybe reparations to some extent.

 

[FortyTwo]

Some scattered thoughts...

-I don't mind someone doing a story on pets freaking out as long as the other stuff is covered as well.

I think this is the problem. The Middle East is messy, there's not much that I can personally do about that. But it does annoy me to a great extent when a reporter blatantly ignores the fact that people are dying en masse in favor of a story about pets that are freaking out about the very same rockets that are killing those people.

 

[yakherder]

Another day another conflict. We can define Israel and Palestine however we want, though it's kind of pointless to theorize about what we think is proper if there isn't anything we can do about it. It's like debating whether or not it would be better for a hurricane to turn left or turn right. Ultimately it's gonna go wherever the hell it feels like going. The only thing that could cause either Israel or Palestine to disappear is explosives.

And I hate to say it, but I don't believe for a second that any of the larger entities involved give a damn about either Israel or Palestine, at least not in the abstract. It's all about self interests. It always has been and it always will be. I'm not even criticizing that fact at this point, just stating it. We can display our humanity by sitting here and being sad over the fact that it's happening, but it's still gonna happen. And in this large scale game of chess Palestine is little more than a pawn of both sides of a larger conflict. A low risk way for Iran to test Israel's defensive and offensive capabilities. All they have to do is donate a few rockets then sit back and take notes. The same is true for Israel. They probably won't admit it but I'm sure it's convenient to have a few rockets fired into your country every once in a while so you know whether or not the systems you have in place are going to be effective before an actual threat comes along. And if one of those rockets is fortunate enough to find its way to a target (so long as it's a target of low strategic value), even better. Emotional response can be a valuable thing for an entity that knows how to use it.

http://www.warsintheworld.com/?page=static1325429228

And the person wanting to do a story on pets? Sure, she's a self interested ***, but that hardly makes her unique in the midst of what's going on here. There are bigger fish to fry.