Ahimsa Dairy

Rory17

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Hello đź‘‹,
What are your views on Ahimsa dairy? An Ahimsa dairy farm keeps calves with their mothers until they’re weaned. They don’t slaughter cattle or send cattle to slaughter. They also don’t kill the male calves. When they are old enough, they are put to work. At least one Ahimsa dairy farm names their cattle and seems to *love* them.
Please be kind. I have had at least one not very nice comment when I posted about this to a vegan Facebook group. Being kind to people who aren’t vegan, who are just going vegan, v-curious and those who cheat/slip up on veganism doesn’t equate to supporting animal cruelty. You need to be kind to people as well...
 
Hello đź‘‹,
What are your views on Ahimsa dairy? An Ahimsa dairy farm keeps calves with their mothers until they’re weaned. They don’t slaughter cattle or send cattle to slaughter. They also don’t kill the male calves. When they are old enough, they are put to work. At least one Ahimsa dairy farm names their cattle and seems to *love* them.
Please be kind. I have had at least one not very nice comment when I posted about this to a vegan Facebook group. Being kind to people who aren’t vegan, who are just going vegan, v-curious and those who cheat/slip up on veganism doesn’t equate to supporting animal cruelty. You need to be kind to people as well...
I agree on being kind, but posting this on a vegan page is not right. Veganism is not about being nice while exploiting animals, it's about not exploiting them, and breeding and raising cows for milk is very much exploitation and totally unnecessary

If you hadn't been raised on dairy products you wouldn't miss them. If you make yourself avoid them you will find your cravings go away

In addition to not being good for cows, dairy isn't good for people. Look at the dairy/non dairy aisle. People are quitting dairy for health reasons more than ethics. Keto and paleo are also dairy free. Doctors are recommending people avoid it, people are finding dairy free solves so many inflammatory problems and pains, as well as digestion.

Sure, it's better to source more ethical sources. I don't know about Ahimsa dairy, though I have in India, but I suppose a local small dairy may be a place to investigate.

What kinds of diary products are you looking for? So many new products out there, now even "dairy" that doesn't require the cows! Molecularly the same as diary
 
Hello đź‘‹,
What are your views on Ahimsa dairy? An Ahimsa dairy farm keeps calves with their mothers until they’re weaned. They don’t slaughter cattle or send cattle to slaughter. They also don’t kill the male calves. When they are old enough, they are put to work. At least one Ahimsa dairy farm names their cattle and seems to *love* them.
Please be kind. I have had at least one not very nice comment when I posted about this to a vegan Facebook group. Being kind to people who aren’t vegan, who are just going vegan, v-curious and those who cheat/slip up on veganism doesn’t equate to supporting animal cruelty. You need to be kind to people as well...
I have mixed feelings.
On the one hand, milk is not necessary or essential. Plus animals should not be exploited.

On the other hand, I've made room in my vegan principals to allow for other people to have companion animals and even have animal partners at work.

I was exposed in a documentary to the Abbey of Regina Laudis Dairy. My general impression was that it does more good than harm.

 
It's animal exploitation so I'm against it.

I also wonder of it can truly be self-contained, without slaughtering or selling offspring into more unethical exploitation. How many offspring does each cow have? How many offspring does that next generation have? How long can that growth continue before slaughter is the only financially viable option? Do the farmers withhold medical care as a means of mitigating that problem?

And if they're only reproducing at replacement rate, and the calves get their fill, how much dairy product can each cow produce in its lifetime? That's really inefficient...a lot of input for very little output, meaning high cost and high environmental impact. Dairy is completely unnecessary...what's the point?
 
Hello đź‘‹,
What are your views on Ahimsa dairy? An Ahimsa dairy farm keeps calves with their mothers until they’re weaned. They don’t slaughter cattle or send cattle to slaughter. They also don’t kill the male calves. When they are old enough, they are put to work. At least one Ahimsa dairy farm names their cattle and seems to *love* them.
Please be kind. I have had at least one not very nice comment when I posted about this to a vegan Facebook group. Being kind to people who aren’t vegan, who are just going vegan, v-curious and those who cheat/slip up on veganism doesn’t equate to supporting animal cruelty. You need to be kind to people as well...
How would you feel if the same thing were done with human breast milk? After all, human breast milk is much better suited for humans than cow's milk. We could put a bunch of women in a farm and impregnate them so they have babies and start producing breast milk. We wouldn't kill the babies; we would leave them with their mothers until they're weaned. (But we can't let them stay with their mother too long because we need to take their mother's breast milk and sell it; otherwise, how would we make any money?) Then, when the woman stopped producing milk, we would have to make her pregnant again so that she would produce more milk.

I don't consider impregnating cows against their wishes, and then taking away their babies after a while, to be humane, but even for people who think it is, such "milk" would be extremely expensive. Not only would the calves be drinking most of the milk, but cows are not able to get pregnant forever. Keeping all those cows around after they can no longer give birth and produce breast milk seems extremely inefficient. If all cow's milk were produced this way, only the wealthiest people would be able to afford it; most people would not be able to eat or drink dairy products.

Considering how tasty soymilk is, and how much healthier it is for humans, I have trouble seeing why anyone would support an industry that keeps cows confined, repeatedly impregnates them, and sells their breast milk. There is something very unnatural, let alone cruel, in all of this.

Many vegans feel horrible about the way our society treats animals. They are often stressed out because they are surrounded by the carcasses and secretions of dead animals wherever they go. They don't want to have to constantly defend their decision to live a more compassionate life. They don't want to have to explain to people why they refuse to eat animal products that were produced in supposedly humane ways. They don't want to have to think about the specifics of artifically impregnating cows and then taking away their babies and their milk. It causes vegans mental pain and anguish to have to answer this sort of question. It is therefore unkind to ask them this sort of question. That's why some of them respond unkindly.

The question of whether you want to support cruelty to animals is one that is between you and your conscience. You need to decide whether it is consistent with your core beliefs. No one, vegan or non-vegan, can help you with that.
 
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I've looked at some of your other posts and remembered that you have been struggling between going back and forth between being vegan and vegetarian. I also see that your family is not exactly supportive of your veganism.

I'm thinking that during your periods of being vegan, you may be practicing veganism in an unsustainable way. As much as we want to be vegan and do our best to minimize animal suffering, we also have to think about being kind to ourselves so we don't burn out and stop being vegan. I'm reading a book by Melanie Joy called "Beyond Beliefs". Chapter 6 is titled "Being Vegan: Living and Relating Sustainably in a Non-Vegan World", and I think it could be very helpful to you. This video also covers the same topics:


Please try not to be too hard on yourself. If consuming dairy products for short periods of time helps you to avoid them at other times, then that's better than nothing. Perhaps one day, when you're in a more stable place in your life (i.e., when you're living alone and don't have family members buying you dairy products and making non-vegan cookies in the house), you can become vegan and stay vegan.

As someone who was vegan for 4 months in my mid-20s and then went back to eating large amounts of animal products for the next 11 years before becoming vegan for good, I cannot criticize you in good conscience for being vegetarian rather than vegan. You are doing so much better than I did.
 
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Isn't it only available in UK? Its nice if they get to live and not be slaughtered but there are too many people in the world who eat dairy to make it possible for everyone to pick ahimsa dairy over regular dairy. People cut corners to make more of a profit. When animals are used as a product they will suffer.
 
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Isn't it only available in UK? Its nice if they get to live and not be slaughtered but there are too many people in the world who eat dairy to make it possible for everyone to pick ahimsa dairy over regular dairy. People cut corners to make more of a profit. When animals are used as a product they will suffer.
There are a few in the USA. I think mostly in New England. The famous one I mentioned just makes cheese and I suspect that its super expensive. But that is sort of normal for some cheeses.

I think as far as milk goes, its probably like grass fed beef. Not only will it be more expensive than regular beef but the capacity isn't there. I remember in Cowspiracy they talked about this and I think they said that if there was grass fed cows could only produce like 3% of the current production.
 
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I think as far as milk goes, its probably like grass fed beef. Not only will it be more expensive than regular beef but the capacity isn't there. I remember in Cowspiracy they talked about this and I think they said that if there was grass fed cows could only produce like 3% of the current production.
Yes, I don't think it scales. Not for a population approaching 8 billion potential dairy consumers.

And therefore it goes against Kant's moral philosophy, the so-called Categorical Imperative, which says:

"Act only according to that maxim whereby you can, at the same time, will that it should become a universal law."

Paraphrased: You should live in a way which you would want everyone else to live.

BTW, one of VV's earliest supporters and moderators worked at an Ahimsa dairy for a while. She was/is a vegan. (VV was the forum which was merged with VF a few years ago.)
 
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Yes, I don't think it scales. Not for a population approaching 8 billion potential dairy consumers.

And therefore it goes against Kant's moral philosophy, the so-called Categorical Imperative, which says:

"Act only according to that maxim whereby you can, at the same time, will that it should become a universal law."

Paraphrased: You should live in a way which you would want everyone else to live.
Yes! I like that as far as philosophy goes.

But I'm thinking along maybe economic/ practical with a big heap of romantic misconceptions.

The world isn't going vegan overnight but maybe more humane meat and milk can be a transitionary or incremental step.

also I like driving by pastures and seeing cows. Although maybe I could get used to driving by and seeing zebras and giraffes, too.