I am no longer vegan

[Brian W]

I have decided to drop the label "vegan" because I do not want to be associated with the elitist, self-righteous, self-opinionated people who call themselves vegan and who blandly recite the vapid and intellectually nebulous mantras "He isn't vegan, he is plant based" and "Veganism isn't a diet, it's a way of life"

People who quote these mantras would do well to understand the real history of the Vegan Society.

Vegan Society Today

On April 8, 1945, Watson and his friends met for the first time to begin the founding of a more formal organization, which they named "The Vegan Society." The Society had the same definition and aims for veganism -- an animal-free diet, and encouraging people to avoid non-food animal products as well.

Watson's Vegan Society quickly grew in membership. Within a few years, it attracted the interest of some people that we would today call "animal rights activists." One such person, a man named Leslie J. Cross, was described by vegan historian Leah Leneman, PhD of Edinburgh University, as a "purist" with extremist animal rights views and a strident style.

Cross believed Watson should change the UK Vegan Society into an animal rights organization.

 

[silva]

I really am sorry if i contributed to that. I would totally agree with your stance if i hadn't been faced with so much anti ethic vegan talk from plant based folks.
There is a need for the distinction between those whi don't use animal products, and those who avoid them as well as processed foods, for their own health

 

[shyvas]

I have decided to drop the label "vegan" because I do not want to be associated with the elitist, self-righteous, self-opinionated people who call themselves vegan and who blandly recite the vapid and intellectually nebulous mantras "He isn't vegan, he is plant based" and "Veganism isn't a diet, it's a way of life"

People who quote these mantras would do well to understand the real history of the Vegan Society.

Vegan Society Today

Yes, Donald Watson was a very wise gentleman.

 

[poivron]

I have decided to drop the label "vegan" because I do not want to be associated with the elitist, self-righteous, self-opinionated people who call themselves vegan and who blandly recite the vapid and intellectually nebulous mantras "He isn't vegan, he is plant based" and "Veganism isn't a diet, it's a way of life"

Please reconsider this decision. May I explain why? Years ago, I also decided to stop calling myself vegan for similar reasons: I was disgusted by the superiority complex of the loudest vegans. But during the year or so that I avoided calling myself vegan, I kept finding myself in weird situations with non-vegans where I would try to explain to them why I didn't call myself vegan and get puzzled looks. I realized that I was giving them the impression that veganism is so difficult that it is impossible even for a vegan to be vegan. All animal eaters want is an excuse to keep eating animals, and I was providing an excellent excuse for them. So I went back to calling myself vegan. If some vegan out there thinks that I'm not vegan, that's their problem. There are people out there with personal problems (after all, being human in this world is painful; we all have problems), and some of them are attracted to veganism for the wrong reasons (to feel superior to others). If they don't consider me vegan, that says something about them, not about me. It does not make me non-vegan.

I know that I am vegan because I am doing my best to avoid supporting animal cruelty. And I feel strongly that telling others that they shouldn't call themselves vegan hurts animals by ensuring that veganism stays as small a movement as possible.

I also feel that the three main reasons for going vegan are not mutually exclusive. They complement one another and go together. I went vegan for the animals and came to appreciate the health and environmental aspects much later. Many people go vegan for health reasons and start to care about the ethical and environmental aspects later. It is ungenerous to tell those people that they are not true vegans. It is also counterproductive.

Please continue to call yourself vegan and be the kind of vegan you want other vegans to be. Lead by example. Otherwise, you will be allowing the self-superior vegans to define the movement, and that will help neither animals, nor people's health, nor the environment.

 

[ProtoHuman]

This is often a way of living and fighting cruelty. Sometimes, in order for it to poison evil, it is enough for good people to do nothing

 

[poivron]

I would totally agree with your stance if i hadn't been faced with so much anti ethic vegan talk from plant based folks.
There is a need for the distinction between those whi don't use animal products, and those who avoid them as well as processed foods, for their own health

I believe I have seen some of what you are referring to. For example, as much as I admire the brilliance of Dr. McDougall, he has made a huge effort to distance himself from the vegan community, apparently thinking that being labelled as vegan would marginalize him. The registered dietitian who works with him posts anti-vegan posts on his forum regularly. (He seems to be under the impression that vegans don't care about health and eat nothing but plant-based meat and cheese all day long.) I posted there for a few days when I first discovered it and then quit, disgusted.

But does that make them non-vegan? Does it help to insist that they be labeled plant-based rather than vegan? I don't think so. I would call them vegan. They are imperfect, and they are confused and misguided, but they are part of the movement that is convincing more and more people to stop eating animals and thereby reducing cruelty to animals. The most successful movements are those that are inclusive. They are so successful that they stop being seen as movements and become an intrinsic part of society.

I think that we need to accept diversity within the vegan movement, and that means diversity of opinion as well. For example, given the systemic racism in the U.S. today, the health aspect of veganism is a stronger argument for African Americans than the ethical aspect. (I have heard African American vegans explain this.) If veganism is to be inclusive of Black people, it cannot reject the health argument for veganism. We need to respect that people are individuals and have their own reasons for going vegan. As long as they are no longer supporting animal cruelty with their money, they are, in my book, a part of the vegan movement.

 

[Danielle]

I don't think you should abandon the vegan title over disagreeing with other vegans.
If you don't like other vegans because of how they behave, then you could be a vegan that doesn't behave that way. Screw stereotypes. I do think these type of posts are a bit dramatic.

However I am someone who believes veganism is more than a diet and I think saying if you buy leather you're not vegan is just pointing out the obvious. Veganism can be healthy but it's not the main focus. It's to avoid using animals when possible.

There are some grey areas, like what about cars since its hard to find completely leather free options. They just aren't available yet, and even so it would have to be a specific one. Maybe the car isn't in budget or otherwise attainable. Most people need cars.
Old leather is another. Some don't feel comfortable keeping it around, others think its wasteful to throw out a functioning item they still use.

 

[silva]

I just hope everyone remembers when celebrities say they've gone vegan they can't shame them for wearing ostrich skin boots, or fur coats--as long as they don't eat animal products

Purebred pets are great!

Vegans are fine with animal testing

Why is the shampoo labeled vegan? Who eats shampoo?

and be very very ready to be called one those horrible extremists that give vegans a bad name if you come out about animal rights

I swear when What the Health came out I had people asking me all kinds of questions, and got told I wasn't a 'real vegan'l because I ate processed foods

Seriously, if this continues, I won't be calling myself vegan either....

 

[David3]

For those who haven't seen it:

 

[Mr_Gentleman]

Who would eat that fake lab meat? I think some would because its ethical... but then you're not a vegan any more because its not vegetable.
The guy who claims he invented vegans should have maybe called it something else & vegetarianism should be strictly re-defined as not containing anything animal.
I would much rather have my correct definition of vegetarian back.

 

[Jamie in Chile]

Hi Brian, It´s entirely up to you whether you use vegan or not. Not for others to tell you! One or two responses perhaps marginally the wrong side of politeness here.

I actually did a poll on a vegetarians and vegans facebook page where I explained to people I follow a vegan lifestyle but explained about not being very strict about it and gave examples like I sometimes eat a birthday cake at someone´s party and I eat any bread or pasta and only some of my toiletries are verified vegan that I haven´t checked about and a few other examples and asked people to vote between whether I was vegetarian and vegan. A few people angrily demanded that I add "not even vegetarian" to the poll since one of the things I mentioned was that I very occassionally eat the kids leftover sweets (some with gelatin) rather than chuck them. Should have seen that coming to be honest!

Only about 30% I think it was (of a LOT of votes) thought I was vegan. Easily more than half said I was only vegetarian.

I also wrote an email to the vegan society asking them about it and describing my situation, and they said I was not vegan.

I only did this because people kept asking me if I was vegan and I was stumbling on the answers a bit.

Some people still think I am vegan, even though I have never said that to them. I don´t correct them, but it´s not how I refer to myself.

I think vegans are too strict in the definition and the way they police it.

 

[shyvas]

I actually did a poll on a vegetarians and vegans facebook page where I explained to people I follow a vegan lifestyle but explained about not being very strict about it and gave examples like I sometimes eat a birthday cake at someone´s party and I eat any bread or pasta and only some of my toiletries are verified vegan that I haven´t checked about and a few other examples and asked people to vote between whether I was vegetarian and vegan. A few people angrily demanded that I add "not even vegetarian" to the poll since one of the things I mentioned was that I very occassionally eat the kids leftover sweets (some with gelatin) rather than chuck them. Should have seen that coming to be honest!

Only about 30% I think it was (of a LOT of votes) thought I was vegan. Easily more than half said I was only vegetarian.

I also wrote an email to the vegan society asking them about it and describing my situation, and they said I was not vegan.

I only did this because people kept asking me if I was vegan and I was stumbling on the answers a bit.

Some people still think I am vegan, even though I have never said that to them. I don´t correct them, but it´s not how I refer to myself.

I think vegans are too strict in the definition and the way they police it.

Even though technically you are not a vegan, you're not a typical vegetarian neither. How about a '98% vegan'?

 

[Vegan Dogs]

Seems you are label conscious...

I was vegan before I had heard of the word or label

How about saying I don't murder animals bred as prisoners by humans

Not for my use or my elitist freak pets

 

[Jamie in Chile]

I was vegan before I had heard of the word or label

Interesting. Since you can´t have been checking online which products were vegan before buying them since you had never heard of the word, does this mean that you would read through the list of every ingredient in processed foods before buying them - doing research on ingredients you were unsure about?

Or were you avoiding processed foods completely?

Or were you just buying any processed food that didn´t obviously have animal products? Meaning your veganism wasn´t very strict and from time to time you would consume small amounts of animal products?

 

[Vegan Dogs]

Interesting. Since you can´t have been checking online which products were vegan before buying them since you had never heard of the word, does this mean that you would read through the list of every ingredient in processed foods before buying them - doing research on ingredients you were unsure about?

Or were you avoiding processed foods completely?

Or were you just buying any processed food that didn´t obviously have animal products? Meaning your veganism wasn´t very strict and from time to time you would consume small amounts of animal products?

I was eating fruit and veggies direct not processed

I wasn't in Facebook groups or socially active online

Living in France

You assume things you wish to believe

Others were vegan before the word was invented even your label loving mindset finds that difficult because human sheep need labels but it is true Voltaire, Da Vinci avoided all animal products centuries before the label vegan was invented.

 

[Second Summer]

Da Vinci avoided all animal products

I heard Da Vinci used eggs in some of his paint, just saying And honestly, I don't care, it sounds like he was a one-of-kind, incredible, amazing and brilliant person regardless, who embraced a kinder, gentler attitude to animals at a time when animals were not generally afforded much consideration.

Anyway, to me, veganism is a way of life, but I'm aware the meaning of the word has changed over the years. Which I think is fine. I'm sure it might change further in the future.

I think vegans are too strict in the definition and the way they police it.

I think we should be strict in enforcing what foods and products should be considered vegan, but lenient / tolerant about people labelling themselves as vegan.

Perhaps it would be better to have two different words - 'vegan' could describe food/products, and then we could have another, similar word to describe people who strive to adhere to a 'vegan' lifestyle. I think that would be less confusing, and would probably help us avoid a lot of unnecessary arguments and division.

 

[Mufflon]

Interesting. Since you can´t have been checking online which products were vegan before buying them since you had never heard of the word, does this mean that you would read through the list of every ingredient in processed foods before buying them - doing research on ingredients you were unsure about?

Damn what did vegans do to check ingredients in products before the internet? Were there no "real" vegans?

Or were you just buying any processed food that didn´t obviously have animal products? Meaning your veganism wasn´t very strict and from time to time you would consume small amounts of animal products?

That sounds more than just a little bit elitist.

 

[Jamie in Chile]

I imagine there were probably vegans in prehistoric times. To be a vegan tens of thousands of years ago, I assume all you would have to do is refuse to eat meat and not wear animal skin. There must have been some people that did this. Avoidance of animal skin might have been easier I think in hot countries? I think these would have been the first (human) vegans, regardless of motivation.

An interesting question is to who is the first recorded vegan. I see no reason why you couldn't have been vegan before the actual term was invented, of course.

It's probably going to be difficult to determine who the first recorded vegan was. But I think you might start by looking around 600-900 BC when the Jainist thought was being established in India and elsewhere.

 

[Lou]

Perhaps it would be better to have two different words - 'vegan' could describe food/products, and then we could have another, similar word to describe people who strive to adhere to a 'vegan' lifestyle. I think that would be less confusing, and would probably help us avoid a lot of unnecessary arguments and division.

That fits right into my thinking. I've often said that veganism is a process not a product. when we decide to be vegan we embark on journey, follow a path, veganism is the way - not the destination. Compassion is the destination.

BTW, I didn't make that up. Several authors have said the same thing. Most notably Colleen Patrick Goudreau.

I like this idea also because it takes out the whole personal purity aspect.

What about this idea? Vegan products could be vegan with a small v. Vegan people could be Vegan with a capital V.

 

[Second Summer]

What about this idea? Vegan products could be vegan with a small v. Vegan people could be Vegan with a capital V.

Good try! But I think it needs to be slightly less succinct, especially when spoken. Maybe something like 'veganist' or 'veganian'?

Perhaps not the most imaginative, but I think it also needs to be recognisable as something to do with 'vegan'.