Weak immune system

[Dan77]

Hi everyone,

Apologies if this should go in the transition forum but.....

I've been vegan for about 6 weeks now and am really enjoying it. I went pescatarian last summer. My concern is that I've had no end of viruses this winter - I'd say 80% of the winter from November up to now I've felt run down with various cold like symptoms. These seem to have got worse in the last 5 weeks coinciding with going vegan.

I'm pretty sure I'm getting enough protein and have been taking B12 supplements. I mainly eat a whole food plant based diet and try to follow Dr Greger's Daily Dozen as much as possible. I had blood tests before xmas for kidney & liver function, blood sugars, blood pressure and iron and it all came back fine. I'm going back for more tests for vitamin deficiency next week.

I realise that this is probably the worst time of year for bugs and I do work in a school as a teacher but......I'm definitely more run down this winter than my colleagues and my family. I'm getting a bit tired of the scornful comments and looks from people at work blaming it all on my diet (I imagine you've all been there!)

Did anyone else suffer like this when changing to veganism or am I just unlucky this year?!

 

[David3]

Yes, I experienced the same thing. But, before reading further, please consult your doctor regarding any recurring illnesses (just to be safe).

About 7 years into my veganism (I've been vegan since 1991), there was one year when I got sick (cold and/or flu) 5 or 6 times. I went to a Registered Dietitian, and she had me write down everything I ate for 5 days (a "food diary"). Looking at my food diary, the RD immediately saw the problem. It was not any deficiency in vitamins or minerals. It was a simple lack of calories. Your entire body, including your immune system, is fueled by calories.

I didn't realize that I wasn't getting enough calories, because I always ate when I was hungry, and my weight hadn't changed. The problem was that I was (unintentionally) eating these very low-calorie foods almost exclusively. For example, I would come home and eat nothing but dry shredded wheat cereal (similar to Weetabix in the UK), apples, and a little salad.

Dr. Greger's Daily Dozen is a great food guide! However, if you focus too exclusively on chomping down fruits, greens, berries, cruciferous vegetables, and non-starchy vegetables, you'll be getting plenty of vitamins/minerals, but not enough calories to fuel your body's systems.

An adult male needs perhaps 2000 - 2500 calories per day, depending on height and physical activity. Below are typical calorie content of different plant foods. Note how few calories there are in whole grains, fruits, and non-starchy vegetables.

One cup (about 120 grams) of boiled beans contains about 250 calories.

One cup of boiled whole grains contains about 200 calories.

One cup of fruit contains 40-100 calories.

One cup of non-starchy / cruciferous vegetables contains 5-40 calories.

One cup of nuts or seeds contains 650 - 1000 calories.


You might find it useful to make an appointment with a Registered Dietitian who specializes in vegetarian / vegan diets. In the UK, you can find a local RD through the website of the British Dietetics Association: https://freelancedietitians.org/
.

 

[Dan77]

Thanks for your response Dave...that's really interesting.

My waistline has dropped a little bit since going vegan which I believe to be normal. I've never calorie counted before as I've been lucky enough to never really gain weight throughout my life (42 now).

I'll be sure to check my carbs for the next week or so. A dietitian appointment is a good idea as well and is something I've been considering as well.

 

[Emma JC]

welcome to the forum @Dan77

great answer @David3

Lack of calories is so common and I agree that you may need to eat more - starches are great options (potatoes, sweet potatoes, rice, whole grain sprouted breads etc).

www.cronometer.com is a great way to track both your intake and your use of those calories - if you track for a week you will get a better handle on it!

Emma JC

 

[Dan77]

Thanks Emma. A typical day's diet would be:

Porridge with oat milk, banana and a tablespoon of peanut butter and flaxseed.

Falafel wholemeal wrap with spinach and houmus.

Some kind of plant based curry/chilli type dish with quinoa or rice.

Berries and soy yoghurt.

Snacks: popcorn, orange, apple, marmite on toast.

I'll use the link you posted and see what happens!

 

[David3]

Hi Dan,

The Vegan Society, the Vegetarian Resource Group, and other mainstream vegan organizations recommend this approximate ratio of foods (see image below).

Vegetables and fruits are important, but higher calorie foods (nuts, seeds, and legumes (pulses)) are also important.

The Vegan Society (UK) has published this webpage about vegan nutrition: https://www.vegansociety.com/resources/nutrition-and-health/nutrition-overview

 

[Dan77]

Brill, thanks!

 

[Emma JC]

You are welcome.

Here's the thing, there is nothing about eating healthier that will cause your symptoms and so if they persist and you are eating enough then you should maybe consult a medical professional, hopefully plant-based.

I will be interested to know what Cronometer says about your calories.

Emma JC

 

[Mischief]

I've been vegetarian for about three decades, and stopped eating dairy and eggs about fifteen years ago.

I used to get one cold per winter, at the end of the year, when I would get really run down between a heavy year-end work load and the holidays. I haven't had a cold in about fifteen years, although I did get the flu once, two years ago.

I've always had a good immune system, and I don't think I reduced my calorie intake when I stopped eating meat, or when I stopped eating dairy and eggs.

My point is that a vegetarian or vegan diet doesn't make you weaker or more susceptible, if you're eating well and eating enough.

From what you describe as a typical day's food, though, it sounds to me as though you may well be calorie deficient.

 

[silva]

Hi everyone,

Apologies if this should go in the transition forum but.....

I've been vegan for about 6 weeks now and am really enjoying it. I went pescatarian last summer. My concern is that I've had no end of viruses this winter - I'd say 80% of the winter from November up to now I've felt run down with various cold like symptoms. These seem to have got worse in the last 5 weeks coinciding with going vegan.

I'm pretty sure I'm getting enough protein and have been taking B12 supplements. I mainly eat a whole food plant based diet and try to follow Dr Greger's Daily Dozen as much as possible. I had blood tests before xmas for kidney & liver function, blood sugars, blood pressure and iron and it all came back fine. I'm going back for more tests for vitamin deficiency next week.

I realise that this is probably the worst time of year for bugs and I do work in a school as a teacher but......I'm definitely more run down this winter than my colleagues and my family. I'm getting a bit tired of the scornful comments and looks from people at work blaming it all on my diet (I imagine you've all been there!)

Did anyone else suffer like this when changing to veganism or am I just unlucky this year?!

Stick with Dr Greger! Remember the DD is a minimum of food. Your gut biome is still adjusting to the change from a meat based diet to plant based so it's not a wonder you'd be more compromised- esp this time of year.
Have you had your D level checked? I take D3 as I found I was very low, sun and D2 didn't raise my levels.

What Foods to Eat to Boost Immunity

nutritionfacts.org

 

[blazebusiness]

I agree with the other posts here...... your blood tests came back fine , so if there is no underlying medical issue going on ...... the volume of food we must eat as a vegan is much larger as the majority of vegan foods usually have much much lower calorie counts. (unless we are talking about nuts/seeds/avocados or oils)

So , for example , if you were eating 3 decent sized plates of food before ..... 3 plates of vegan chow probably won't come close to the amount of calories you need. Start keeping track of your caloric intake. Followup later and let us know how you are doing.

 

[Dan77]

Thanks for the replies everyone. Silva, you were right....my Vit D levels are through the floor!

I've been prescribed strong pills (50,000 units) once a week for six weeks. Tbh I'm pushing for an injection initially to get it into my system quicker.

My calorie intake seems pretty good following the cronometer app for the last week so hopefully I'll start to feel better once the Vit D starts flowing again.

The UK is bloody grim in the winter!

 

[Lou]

Just two more thoughts.

I don't get colds or flu, but 20 years ago I went to work for a company that had hundreds of employees. Most of whom I had at least some contact with. Plus I went back to school and was surrounded by thousands of people. That year I had so many colds. I think some of them even overlapped. I did start washing my hands A Lot.

The following year I was back in perfect health again. Every virus is different and you can only get sick from it once. I think I just had no immunity to lots of them. and then i developed immunity to most of them.

The other issue is stress. People who are under a lot of stress get sick more often. There is even a syndrome that links illnesses to traumatic events that occurred the previous year.

 

[ethansmith]

Hi Dan,
I think better to see a nutritionist. I felt those symptoms too but when I consulted a licensed nutritionist, he advised me to change my diet plan. I added more fruits in my diet as it balanced my daily calorie intake and maintained my immunity. He also advised me to add almonds and other healthy nuts in daily diet. It took some days, but as I completely followed the advice, my symptoms get better.

 

[Lou]

Hi Dan,
I think better to see a nutritionist. I felt those symptoms too but when I consulted a licensed nutritionist, he advised me to change my diet plan. I added more fruits in my diet as it balanced my daily calorie intake and maintained my immunity. He also advised me to add almonds and other healthy nuts in daily diet. It took some days, but as I completely followed the advice, my symptoms get better.

Do the words nutritionist and dietician have different meanings in the UK?

Here in the USA nutritionist aren't registered. (Well, at least not in California. Maybe it varies state by state) But Dieticians can be Registered. Like a Registered Nurse. But I think anyone can just call themselves a nutritionist.
This article also brings up the term Certified Nutrition Specialist, CSN. I don't think I've run into that term before. Maybe that is also something that is not in California.

What Is The Difference Between A Nutritionist And A Dietitian? - Nutrition Science Degree

Dietitians and nutritionists evaluate the health of their clients. And based on their findings, they advise clients on which foods to eat. Both are both experts in food and diet, and both are considered to be healthcare professions. So what are the differences? Dietitians and nutritionists are...

nutritionsciencedegree.org

 

[Lou]

Oh, wait. This makes it crystal clear.

Dietitian - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Nutritionist - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[silva]

Thanks for the replies everyone. Silva, you were right....my Vit D levels are through the floor!

I've been prescribed strong pills (50,000 units) once a week for six weeks. Tbh I'm pushing for an injection initially to get it into my system quicker.

My calorie intake seems pretty good following the cronometer app for the last week so hopefully I'll start to feel better once the Vit D starts flowing again.

The UK is bloody grim in the winter!

For a couple years I had severe seizing of my ankles with pain I could only call 'in my bones'. Doctors had me go through cat scans of my ankles, sent me to orthopedic specialists, suggested physical therapy and orthodics for my shoes . Research led me to ask about my D levels, and I was asked if I spent time in the sun without screen---yes I did, I walked every morning in a tank top all summer, I took vitamin D2. I was told it wasn't checked, there was no reason. I asked to have it done, i would cover the cost if I had to, and it was at 11. All that testing, visits, all the while I was deficient in D. After my initial boost I take 5000 iu daily, because the yeat I spent taking 2000 iu I still came up short. Why? I don't have answers.
I hope this help you, D is so important in overall health
I also take b12 2000 twice weekly, and an algae dha, per Dr Greger. I feel better taking the dha

 

[LoreD]

There are quite vegan meal plans from some reputable sources. The PlantStrong program and a few others.

It might help if everything was set up for you, and you didn't have to worry about the calorie counting.

The thing you have to remember is that you need to eat more food. You should eat larger portions because veggies, fruits, grains, and beans are not as calorie dense as meat and dairy products.

Whole Foods Market offers a meal plan that looks pretty good

Whole Foods Market UK

www.wholefoodsmarket.com

Veganuary meal plan

Vegan Meal Plans to Download for Free | Veganuary

veganuary.com

 

[LoreD]

Hi everyone,

Apologies if this should go in the transition forum but.....

I've been vegan for about 6 weeks now and am really enjoying it. I went pescatarian last summer. My concern is that I've had no end of viruses this winter - I'd say 80% of the winter from November up to now I've felt run down with various cold like symptoms. These seem to have got worse in the last 5 weeks coinciding with going vegan.

I'm pretty sure I'm getting enough protein and have been taking B12 supplements. I mainly eat a whole food plant based diet and try to follow Dr Greger's Daily Dozen as much as possible. I had blood tests before xmas for kidney & liver function, blood sugars, blood pressure and iron and it all came back fine. I'm going back for more tests for vitamin deficiency next week.

I realise that this is probably the worst time of year for bugs and I do work in a school as a teacher but......I'm definitely more run down this winter than my colleagues and my family. I'm getting a bit tired of the scornful comments and looks from people at work blaming it all on my diet (I imagine you've all been there!)

Did anyone else suffer like this when changing to veganism or am I just unlucky this year?!

Here is a really good source for vegan meals that have a lot of substance to them. I've tried a few and they're pretty tasty. He is a UK YouTuber.

Whoops, I didn't notice that Dan has been gone for a year.

https://m.youtube.com/channel/UCHmZjV16rxExTImGh6I_buA

 

[Ahimsa]

Hi everyone,

Apologies if this should go in the transition forum but.....

I've been vegan for about 6 weeks now and am really enjoying it. I went pescatarian last summer. My concern is that I've had no end of viruses this winter - I'd say 80% of the winter from November up to now I've felt run down with various cold like symptoms. These seem to have got worse in the last 5 weeks coinciding with going vegan.

I'm pretty sure I'm getting enough protein and have been taking B12 supplements. I mainly eat a whole food plant based diet and try to follow Dr Greger's Daily Dozen as much as possible. I had blood tests before xmas for kidney & liver function, blood sugars, blood pressure and iron and it all came back fine. I'm going back for more tests for vitamin deficiency next week.

I realise that this is probably the worst time of year for bugs and I do work in a school as a teacher but......I'm definitely more run down this winter than my colleagues and my family. I'm getting a bit tired of the scornful comments and looks from people at work blaming it all on my diet (I imagine you've all been there!)

Did anyone else suffer like this when changing to veganism or am I just unlucky this year?!

I would say that some form of stress/anxiety is probably the cause of your symptoms, it's certainly not your vegan diet. You say that this time of year is the worst for bugs etc but the winter of 20/21 has been the healhiest ever, due to people wearing masks and socially isolating. However, many people have been suffering from stress related problems like fatigue and symptoms of a cold. If this is the case then I don't think your problems are going to go away anytime soon, especially as you work in a school. My advice would be to try relaxation exercises and anything else that will help reduce stress and anxiety.