Vegan or strict Vegetarian

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thinman

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In my youth a vegetarian was the same as a vegan, seems now if you say vegetarian people assume lacto-ovo.
 

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I was lacto-vegetarian for several years before I went vegan. I always thought it seemed like jumping to conclusions to assume if someone said they were vegetarian, then they meant lacto-ovo vegetarian.
 

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if you say vegetarian people assume lacto-ovo


I can certainly agree with that except for the “But do you eat fish” question that always seems to arise. And if you do, you could reply, “Yes. I’m a pesco-lacto-ovo-vegetarian.” We sure can get ourselves in a twist when it comes to definitions!

In my youth a vegetarian was the same as a vegan


I cannot agree with that. It was certainly outside my experience. To me it always simply meant not eating meat.

Donald Watson obviously was of that opinion. It was in the late forties that he said, “Vegan is the beginning and the end of vegetarian.” The cleverness of this is in its double meaning.

Firstly it is literally the beginning and the end of the actual word vegetarian.

But secondly it means taking vegetarianism to its logical conclusion which is, of course, eating vegetables only. If you want to be pedantic about all this you could ask, “Well what about nuts and fruits. They are not vegetables.” Again, we sure can get ourselves in a twist when it comes to definitions!

Roger.
 
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Twenty - thirty years ago, I thought "vegetarian" meant" strict vegetarian". that if you ate eggs or milk you had to use the prefixes. If you didn't, you didn't. I am not sure if my understanding of the word vegetarian was common. I also remember having an argument about it with another vegetarian. It still seems logical - if an ova- vegetarian eats eggs, and a lacto-vegetarian drinks milk, then having no prefix means you don't eat either.

Eggs and milk were the first things I cut out of my diet. Totally for ethical concerns. (reading a newspaper article on dairy was my tipping point). So when i stopped eating meat, I automatically became a "strict vegetarian" even tho I thought I was just "vegetarian".

I was always interested in nutrition and science. But I really didn't know enough about being a healthy vegetarian at the time. that might be why I'm so enthusiastic about helping people transition here. I didn't have any good help. But I was lucky. while persuing the library I stumbled upon Living Vegan for Dummies.

Maybe half the reason I became interested in becoming "vegan" was that it was four fewer syllables than "strict vegetarian"

Another lucky thing was that since I gave up milk I have been drinking soy milk which IS already fortified. At the time there weren't other options.
 
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thinman

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Back then was around 1970 Vegetarian. How is Plant Base different ? is it coz it mainly deals with eating and not deal with animal rights.

I notice the option on this forum for strict vegetarian and just vegetarian, does the vegetarian mean lacto-ovo ?

My wife (vegan) was going to her zen group whole day meditation, the teacher sez to bring lunch and added it should be vegetarian, then sez he was bringing boiled eggs and cheese. My wife sez to me "what the flippin' eck!".
 

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From the Meriam-Webster dictionary

Definition of vegetarian
(Entry 1 of 2)
1: a person who does not eat meat : someone whose diet consists wholly of vegetables, fruits, grains, nuts, and sometimes eggs or dairy products

From the Vegetarian Society

A vegetarian diet can include…A vegetarian diet does not include…
  • Vegetables and fruits
  • Grains and pulses
  • Nuts and seeds
  • Eggs
  • Dairy products
  • Honey
  • Meat or poultry
  • Fish or seafood
  • Insects
  • Gelatine or animal rennet
  • Stock or fat from animals

In addition, a vegan diet does not include eggs, dairy or honey.

Vegetarians and vegans don’t eat products or by-products of slaughter. They don’t eat any foods which have been made using processing aids from slaughter.

-https://vegsoc.org/info-hub/definition/




Plant-based” typically refers to one who eats a diet based primarily on plant foods, with limited to no animal-derived products. A whole foods, plant-based diet means that oils and processed packaged foods are likewise excluded.

-https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/plant-based-diet-vs-vegan

A vegan eats a strict vegetarian diet. Plus you have to throw in the whole lifestyle.

many vegans eat a whole food plant-based diet. but not all plant-based dieters are vegan.
 
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Mmm does that mean you are from Asia? Because I've mostly heard this as being a Japanese or Korean thing. I've known tons of older vegetarians (I'm in my 30s, so I mean people over 50 mainly) because I live in California. Especially when I lived in LA, I used to go to the original Follow Your Heart cafe, and there was tons of historical stuff there... in the 70s they ate all plant-based with the exception of raw milk and goat cheese, in the common belief that dairy is ethical as long as any cruelty is minimized. Other vegetarians may take the opposite view, thinking that all milk is cruel, but that eating eggs is okay as long as the chickens are well-treated, thus the term Veggan...I tend to agree that they are minimizing harm, I dated a guy who had his own backyard chickens and ducks whom he loved as pets, re-feeding them the shells or inedible eggs, as well as food scraps like apple cores. There was nothing wrong with those chickens' lives, in an objective sense. He wasn't exploiting them or intentionally breeding them for egg production, only taking them for himself, and occasionally for a friend or family member or guest to his home. He drank plant-based milks, used nutritional yeast, and only ate other animal products once a week or less if he went to a restaurant.

I do know "vegetarians" who do questionable things like use chicken broth or carelessly purchase factory-farmed dairy and eggs. The chicken broth people especially get on my nerves, I'm just like "really? REALLY??"
 

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Back then was around 1970 Vegetarian. How is Plant Base different ? is it coz it mainly deals with eating and not deal with animal rights.

I notice the option on this forum for strict vegetarian and just vegetarian, does the vegetarian mean lacto-ovo ?

My wife (vegan) was going to her zen group whole day meditation, the teacher sez to bring lunch and added it should be vegetarian, then sez he was bringing boiled eggs and cheese. My wife sez to me "what the flippin' eck!".

Strict vegetarian can mean a variety of things. One being that some people don't like the term "vegan" for whatever reason. Another being that they may eat honey, OR only eat "ethically sourced" local dairy or backyard eggs - like they still don't purchase any milk/eggs from a factory farm or other questionable source.
 

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vegetarian and vegan have always had different meanings when I heard of them. I used to think veganism was impossible but that I could maybe be vegetarian. After going vegetarian I got hooked on things that made it harder to go vegan like greek yogurt and cabot cheese, but I still chose to no longer eat those things. I thought the animal free rennet cheese tasted better than the standard type. There’s still no good replacement for greek yogurt, but I enjoy kite hills key lime.
 

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vegetarian and vegan have always had different meanings when I heard of them. I used to think veganism was impossible but that I could maybe be vegetarian. After going vegetarian I got hooked on things that made it harder to go vegan like greek yogurt and cabot cheese, but I still chose to no longer eat those things. I thought the animal free rennet cheese tasted better than the standard type. There’s still no good replacement for greek yogurt, but I enjoy kite hills key lime.

Dairy free products made by both Oatly ( they have a Greek style yogurt) & Alpro taste virtually the same as dairy. These brands taste so different to anything that I have tried in the US.

 

Forest Nymph

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vegetarian and vegan have always had different meanings when I heard of them. I used to think veganism was impossible but that I could maybe be vegetarian. After going vegetarian I got hooked on things that made it harder to go vegan like greek yogurt and cabot cheese, but I still chose to no longer eat those things. I thought the animal free rennet cheese tasted better than the standard type. There’s still no good replacement for greek yogurt, but I enjoy kite hills key lime.

I think Follow Your Heart's plain coconut yogurt has a lot of the consistency and texture of greek yogurt.
 

Lou

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Strict vegetarian can mean a variety of things. One being that some people don't like the term "vegan" for whatever reason. Another being that they may eat honey, OR only eat "ethically sourced" local dairy or backyard eggs - like they still don't purchase any milk/eggs from a factory farm or other questionable source.


I'm pretty sure that strict vegetarian means no meat, fish, eggs, milk, honey.... etc.
but it doesn't mean no leather, silk, or wool.

It's basically Just the vegan diet. You could say that a vegan eats a strict vegetarian diet. Or a strict vegetarian eats a vegan diet.
 

Forest Nymph

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I'm pretty sure that strict vegetarian means no meat, fish, eggs, milk, honey.... etc.
but it doesn't mean no leather, silk, or wool.

It's basically Just the vegan diet. You could say that a vegan eats a strict vegetarian diet. Or a strict vegetarian eats a vegan diet.

Yeah I mean that makes sense. I just think there are different interpretations of what it means. Like some people who practice spiritual philosophies that revere all life might still consume milk from their neighbor's cows and/or who think honey is one of the world's most essential foods. They're still very strict though. Like the Buddhist monastery not too far from here, they have all of these teachings on vegetarianism, they tell people not to bring meat, fish or eggs on to their property, they protect wild animals that live near the monastery, I consider people like that to be strict vegetarians. Also - the honey thing. There are people who call themselves vegan even who eat raw local honey because they feel it's actually necessary for thriving honey bee populations due to all of the threats to bees.
 

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I think Follow Your Heart's plain coconut yogurt has a lot of the consistency and texture of greek yogurt.
The lack of a honey substitute is kinda a bummer with vegan greek yogurts. I only liked one brand and flavor of greek yogurt so it might be impossible to replace. Oh well, there's non greek yogurts that I can enjoy without comparing it to something else. Anything with either caramel or lime, sometimes chocolate.
 
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The lack of a honey substitute is kinda a bummer with vegan greek yogurts. I only liked one brand and flavor of greek yogurt so it might be impossible to replace. Oh well, there's non greek yogurts that I can enjoy without comparing it to something else. Anything with either caramel or lime, sometimes chocolate.

Why don't you try making your own Greek style yogurt ?:)
 

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I've just discovered another term, pollotarian ! It would seem that the list is forever growing and never ending! :confused:


During my last trip to the UK, I met a couple who said that they were 'veggie' so I automatically assumed that they were
vegetarians. To my dismay, the woman ate fish and the man ate the latter plus chicken !
 

Lou

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I've just discovered another term, pollotarian ! It would seem that the list is forever growing and never ending! :confused:


During my last trip to the UK, I met a couple who said that they were 'veggie' so I automatically assumed that they were
vegetarians. To my dismay, the woman ate fish and the man ate the latter plus chicken !


So the article doesn't actually say it but it implies that a vegetarian does not eat milk or eggs (or fish or chicken). Or what I have been calling a strict vegetarian. Maybe the word strict vegetarian is important to distinguish yourself from all the other vegetarians who eat fish, chicken, eggs, milk.
 

Danielle

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I've just discovered another term, pollotarian ! It would seem that the list is forever growing and never ending! :confused:


During my last trip to the UK, I met a couple who said that they were 'veggie' so I automatically assumed that they were
vegetarians. To my dismay, the woman ate fish and the man ate the latter plus chicken !
I thought pescatarian was just as dumb, what next? bacontarian? come on lol
pescivore or pollivore would make more sense to me
 
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shyvas

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So the article doesn't actually say it but it implies that a vegetarian does not eat milk or eggs (or fish or chicken). Or what I have been calling a strict vegetarian. Maybe the word strict vegetarian is important to distinguish yourself from all the other vegetarians who eat fish, chicken, eggs, milk.

Vegetatians don't eat flesh i.e. chicken or fish. I know that some who call themselves vegetarians, do so.