This is the face of individuals with real principles

[Mischief]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...a6bb7a-9815-11e3-afce-3e7c922ef31e_story.html

Whether you agree with what they did or not, this is how someone with real principles acts, not like Snowden.

 

[Freesia]

True, they do have real principles. But it doesnt mean that Snowden does not.

 

[Mischief]

True, they do have real principles. But it doesnt mean that Snowden does not.

I don't see doing X (whether or not one thinks doing X is justified) and then running away to hide in a country (and let oneself be used as a publicity tool for that country) that has a much, much worse record with respect to the behavior that one has found offensive shows any principles or convictions whatsoever. I think it's the action of someone who acted out of a personal snit and then lacked the maturity and integrity to face consequences. If Snowden spends the rest of his life in Russia (which I hope he does), then he will spend that life feeling extremely sorry for himself, as soon as his novelty has worn off sufficiently so that he is no longer of use to the corrupt regime and starts to be treated like everyone else who neither has usefulness as a publicity tool nor wields any power himself.

 

[Blobbenstein]

If Snowden had stayed in the US, would his trial etc have been behind closed doors?

 

[Mischief]

As a U.S. citizen and a civilian, I don't know of any law where that would have happened.

 

[ledboots]

If Snowden had stayed in the US, would his trial etc have been behind closed doors?

I fear he would have just disappeared.

 

[Trinity]

Whether you agree with what they did or not, this is how someone with real principles acts, not like Snowden.

I am not quite sure what propaganda you've been reading, but as someone who has watched the Snowden case since he broadcast his first video with the Guardian newspaper in the UK, I can say that (in my opinion) Snowden has incredible principles. I find it really harsh that after everything he's done that anyone can accuse him of not having real principles.

He has risked his life in ways that most of us can only imagine, to bring a truth to the world that most governments in the modern world do not want made public.

Snowden knows that he would not be given a fair and free trail - because what he has been accused of doesn't not give him that opportunity.

See a recent video that the media blacked out here:
http://wakeup-world.com/2014/02/14/media-blacks-out-interview-the-government-doesnt-want-you-to-see/

 

[ledboots]

In Snowden's words:
"If I am traitor, who did I betray? I gave all my information to the American public, to American journalists who are reporting on American issues. If they see that as treason, I think people really need to consider who they think they’re working for. The public is supposed to be their boss, not their enemy. Beyond that as far as my personal safety, I’ll never be fully safe until these systems have changed."

 

[Mischief]

I'll reconsider my opinion on Snowden at the time he denounces Russia's practices. When do you think that's likely to happen?

And for the conspiracy minded - can you give me some examples of U.S. citizens with a high publicity profile that have been made to "disappear"?

 

[Blobbenstein]

do you think Snowden acted in self interest, in this whole affair?
Surely he could have stayed in his nice job, and kept quiet.

 

[Mischief]

I think he's an immature person who acted in a fit of pique. I think it's all about him and attention seeking, and has very little to do with what is "right" for anyone other than himself. IOW, a narcissist rather than a person of principle. If it were about principle, he wouldn't be in Russia (thereby implicitly conveying the message that Russia is better than the U.S.), a country which imprisoned a girl band for criticizing the government (not publicizing classified information which he had agreed to keep secret), and which has most recently taken to flogging that same girl band with a horsewhip.

Really, am I the only person on this board who sees the laughable absurdity of this?!

 

[Trinity]

Really, am I the only person on this board who sees the laughable absurdity of this?!

Where are you actually getting your news on his story from?

He applied for political asylum in lots of other countries (who all seem to be running scared of the US). Some countries we're threatened by the US (like if they gave him asylum they'd take away their trade agreement). His journey was meant to be Hong Kong - Russia - South America. The US killed his passport, trapping him in Russia. He didn't really have any choice in the matter.

Have you actually read any 'real' news about this story or have you only heard what the government wants you to hear?

 

[Trinity]

I think he's an immature person who acted in a fit of pique.

That's funny - if you've actually listened to any of his interviews you'd see that he a well grounded person, who clearly acted from a place of centerdness. He says that he'd hoped that the system would change when Obama came into power..... but it got worse. So eventually he spoke out. Certainly doesn't sound like an immature pique fit to me.

When a system is so corrupt, then surely the people have a right to know. Who is the real criminal?

 

[Mischief]

And I repeat my question - when do you anticipate that this "principled" person will take his principled stand about what is done in Russia?

It's a question that everyone seems to be evading.

 

[Blobbenstein]

Why should he? Russia is protecting him; the US was his enemy.

Why, if he takes a principled stand in one part of the world, does he have to always do it, for the whole world? Does he claim to be a saint?

 

[Blobbenstein]

perhaps those peace activists in your op should go to Russia and take a stand when they get out of prison.

 

[Trinity]

It's a question that everyone seems to be evading.

Are you evading questions yourself?

 

[Moll Flanders]

I think he's an immature person who acted in a fit of pique. I think it's all about him and attention seeking, and has very little to do with what is "right" for anyone other than himself. IOW, a narcissist rather than a person of principle. If it were about principle, he wouldn't be in Russia (thereby implicitly conveying the message that Russia is better than the U.S.), a country which imprisoned a girl band for criticizing the government (not publicizing classified information which he had agreed to keep secret), and which has most recently taken to flogging that same girl band with a horsewhip.

Really, am I the only person on this board who sees the laughable absurdity of this?!

I am not an expert in the matter but I think his actions brought the issue of privacy invasion into the public domain so people have become more informed about surveillance. I don't know if I consider him a hero. I agree with you about Russia btw but it seems like he didn't have many options available to him to escape?

 

[Mischief]

I asked my question first.

What Snowden has done is a lot like this: I sabotage a factory farm in the U.S. and then leave the country to evade prosecution. I seek refuge on a dog fur farm in China, where I continue to talk about the evils of factory farming in the U.S. while remaining remarkably silent about dogs being skinned alive outside my window.

ETA: This post was not in response to your post, Moll, but to the posts above yours.

 

[Blobbenstein]

no, what he did was release information about the factory farm in the US. Information that wasn't available before. He isn't suppressing information about the dogs being skinned.