Seems like I can't eat anything

[chamomile]

So I'm 17 and I became vegan 3+ weeks ago.

btw english is my 3rd language and I'm tired so sorry for mistakes

It wasn't easy since it was a very quick and random desicion, nobody around me is vegan, I struggle with an eating disorder, and severe ocd and constantly making sure my food, hygiene stuff and other things are vegan is extremely exhausting. My countries national dishes are a no go now, cause they aren't vegan. Socializing is even harder than it already was because of my mental health. Also at first I couldn't fine any vegan products. But I'm still vegan.

But the more I go through vegan subbreddits the more it seems like I can't eat anything.

Fruit juices? They use isinglass for filtration. Every other drink I can find seems to belong to Coca-Cola company which is unethical. Avocados aren't ethical, coconut stuff aren't ethical because they enslave monkeys or some **** like that. Apparently alpro which was my go to brand and I was exited it exists is also unethical because it belongs to Danone and also something about Palestine. Coffee and chocolate are also unethical cause of child labor. Same goes for palm oil which is in almost every vegan thing i can find. Almonds too. Bananas also are unethical. The super nice meat substitutes I found belong to Nestlé, which is unethical too.

But at the same time if you stop buying vegan stuff from non vegan companies, they will just put more money in they animal product business, since it would send a message that there isn't any demand for vegan stuff. So it won't even really help the situation.

At this point I'm just exhausted and confused. Sure a lot of people say that chocolate, coffee, bananas, avocados, almonds and plant based milk isn't a necessity. Well kinda yeah and now I feel selfish.

Like I don't buy from companies like shein, I try to only buy secondhand clothes, make sure my food is vegan, spend hours researching which brands are cruelty free and vegan cause its hard to find certain products in my country. But yeah I probably could survive without oat milk and coffee for example. But using this logic you need to cut out almost everything and just live on vegetables which would make my life even more miserable than it already is.

 

[Second Summer]

Hi there @chamomile ! Welcome on board, and your English is great, I have zero problems reading your post.

Disclaimer: I'm not a medical doctor (obviously), just some guy on the Internet dishing out potentially bad advice. Take it with a grain of salt and don't blame me if it all goes horribly wrong.

Are you getting treatment for the eating disorder and the OCD? That really needs to be priority number one. Let's face it, a hospitalised or worse young person is not what we want.

So, I think first of all you need to cut yourself some slack. A lot of slack, considering your situation. You need to not only cope with your eating disorder and OCD, but also what might be a limited supply of vegan specialty food, at least compared to some other places like in the UK. I suspect few people even on these boards apply quite as strict criteria for what they consume as you seem to want.

Remember, the main point of veganism (according to me and many others) is to help advance the rights and welfare of animals. But as individual consumers we have very limited impact. Still, we should try to do something, and something is always better than nothing!

Your first priority should be to stay well and healthy. Veganism, or your "journey" (I hate that word) towards veganism should be something like second or third priority.

Considering your limited access to what might be considered "ethical" vegan food, don't worry too much about the companies producing these at the moment. You need food to survive, which is part of your first priority. If your chocolate, coffee, bananas, avocados, almonds and plant based milk are vegan and they can help you transition to veganism, then go for it, absolutely.

It's also true, some foods and drinks you don't really need. I stopped drinking fizzy drinks many years ago, for example. I drink juices and plant milks instead. In particular fortified plant milks, because they usually have calcium which can otherwise be difficult to get in sufficient quantities on a vegan diet.

There is a lot more to be said, about iron and B12 and other things, but I hope you've already read about that, so in the interest of keeping this short-ish I will end it here for now.

I hope you're doing well! Eat or drink something good! (What do you usually eat in a day?)

 

[shyvas]

But the more I go through vegan subbreddits the more it seems like I can't eat anything.

Fruit juices? They use isinglass for filtration. Every other drink I can find seems to belong to Coca-Cola company which is unethical. Avocados aren't ethical, coconut stuff aren't ethical because they enslave monkeys or some **** like that. Apparently alpro which was my go to brand and I was exited it exists is also unethical because it belongs to Danone and also something about Palestine. Coffee and chocolate are also unethical cause of child labor. Same goes for palm oil which is in almost every vegan thing i can find. Almonds too. Bananas also are unethical. The super nice meat substitutes I found belong to Nestlé, which is unethical too.

Hello there and welcome to the forum.

With regards to the food that you mention here are a few tips: fruit juices; you can make your own. Many shop brands don't use animal products in fruit juices so check the label. Buy coconut milk products made in Indonesia as they don't use monkeys. Fizzy drinks; buy plain fizzy water and add either fruit juice or fruit flavours. Coffee and chocolate; buy Fairtrade products as they are child labour free. I you have either health food or organic stores in your country you should be able to buy plant based milk/yogurts and tofu. You can also make your own oat milk.

Home page - Sojade

Sojade’s 100% organic, French and vegan products have been boosting your well-being daily since 2002. Try our plant-based range!

sojade.eu

The above French company exports to many European countries including the UK. You can usually find their products which are quite tasty and available in small independant health food stores.

 

[Lou]

So I read your post yesterday and my first response was not to answer it at all - your question or issue was just too difficult.

this morning when I woke up, your post was what I was thinking about. So to get if off my mind here goes.

But first I have to give kudos to SecondSummer who has provided you with a great answer. I wholeheartedly agree with everything he said. I don't want to repeat everything he said although most of what he says bears or deserves repeating.

you admit the decision to become vegan was quick and random and I believe that was a mistake. Being vegan is a big commitment and deserves a lot of thought and deliberation.

Also remaining vegan requires some research. There is information that you need and although much of it is in vegan subreddits, that is not the best way to acquire it.

The eating disorder and the OCD are big and real problems that need to be addressed. I'll touch on it here but really these issues required qualified personal that actually get to know you.

There are two problems with a person with an eating disorder becoming vegan. Two sides of the same coin. Here in the US there are articles in medical journals warning that an anorexic finds veganism a useful shield or camouflage for their disorder. The "oh I can't eat that" is basically what it comes down to. On the other side of the coin, the stress of just trying to be vegan can trigger anorexia.

So now for my advice. Be aware that free advice is worth what you pay for it.

You vegan journey stated like being shot out of a cannon. You need to back up and then start slower. Some of my favorite gurus say that you don't need to finish your research before you start but you do need to start your research before you start. Some of your issues are philosophical and are going to have flexible answers and solutions. But it's going to come down to How Vegan Do You Want To Be? Vegans call this Vegan Purity. For me the acid test is Does This Help The Animals". No one can be 100% vegan. So how vegan do you want to be Is 97% good enough. How about 91%. At school both of those get you an A.

I can't remember who said this but it has become a guiding principle in my life.
Perfection is the enemy of good.

How to go vegan

Overnight or gradual change? Top tips on how to go vegan.

www.vegansociety.com

 

[LoreD]

One of the problems I'm seeing is a possibility of Orthorexia nervosa. I have seen YouTube videos where the "Clean Eating" protocols have devolved to the point that people have restricted their food down to the point that they LITERALLY starved to death.

"Orthorexia nervosa is an eating disorder that involves a fixation on healthy eating. A person with the disorder may focus so much on optimal nutrition that it impacts other aspects of their life."

I think before you make this journey you need to seek treatment for the OCD and eating disorder. You are doing something that is very dangerous.

 

[chamomile]

Hi there @chamomile ! Welcome on board, and your English is great, I have zero problems reading your post.

Disclaimer: I'm not a medical doctor (obviously), just some guy on the Internet dishing out potentially bad advice. Take it with a grain of salt and don't blame me if it all goes horribly wrong.

Are you getting treatment for the eating disorder and the OCD? That really needs to be priority number one. Let's face it, a hospitalised or worse young person is not what we want.

So, I think first of all you need to cut yourself some slack. A lot of slack, considering your situation. You need to not only cope with your eating disorder and OCD, but also what might be a limited supply of vegan specialty food, at least compared to some other places like in the UK. I suspect few people even on these boards apply quite as strict criteria for what they consume as you seem to want.

Remember, the main point of veganism (according to me and many others) is to help advance the rights and welfare of animals. But as individual consumers we have very limited impact. Still, we should try to do something, and something is always better than nothing!

Your first priority should be to stay well and healthy. Veganism, or your "journey" (I hate that word) towards veganism should be something like second or third priority.

Considering your limited access to what might be considered "ethical" vegan food, don't worry too much about the companies producing these at the moment. You need food to survive, which is part of your first priority. If your chocolate, coffee, bananas, avocados, almonds and plant based milk are vegan and they can help you transition to veganism, then go for it, absolutely.

It's also true, some foods and drinks you don't really need. I stopped drinking fizzy drinks many years ago, for example. I drink juices and plant milks instead. In particular fortified plant milks, because they usually have calcium which can otherwise be difficult to get in sufficient quantities on a vegan diet.

There is a lot more to be said, about iron and B12 and other things, but I hope you've already read about that, so in the interest of keeping this short-ish I will end it here for now.

I hope you're doing well! Eat or drink something good! (What do you usually eat in a day?)

Hey, thank you for the response, and sorry for responding late, my phone broke so I needed to get it fixed so I wasnt able to answer.

So no I'm not getting treatment yet, I'm on a waitlist for a psychiatrist to get medication for my OCD. With ED.. well it's not as severe as it was before, the main thing is that because of it I'm scared to cook in front of other people, especially my father cause I can't even take a cucumber from the fridge without him making a comment that "wow that's a lot of cucumber u are about to eat" and he is constantly causing me relapses, like usually I don't even try to cook when he is in the house at this point cause I know I'm going th throw up the food later because of his comments. And vegan lifestyle requires way more cooking, so sometimes I end up barely eating if I'm not left alone in the house to cook/don't have vegan snacks. Another thing is that I'm embarrassed to ask to buy me food so I often can't ask for vegan stuff.

I'm trying to not be too strict about what I eat cause then im just becoming straight up paranoid about everything, so i try to relax like if someone makes me vegan stuff I can doubt that it's 100% vegan (non vegan people just can make it non vegan on accident) but I eat it anyway. Or occasionally I can drink juice even if I can't find the info about it to make sure they don't use isiglass, because it's uncommon in europe anyway..

Also yeah I can cut off fizzy drinks already basically did that cause I can't find any ethical ones, I don't drink wine anymore, cause again isinglass, even though I used to drink a lot of it. I barely eat chocolate cause there isn't any vegan chocolate there, I only eat it on vegan ice cream I found and some vegan chocolate spread, but like nothing else vegan with chocolate that I could find.

It's harder to cut off some of the unethical products like avocados, nuts, bananas, coffee, plant based milk, tea, rice. Cause they are a huge part of what I eat and like if I stop eating them I will be left with barely anything to eat. And my physical health is already very bad I'm scared to make it worse.

And you said that "if they help me transition" and that implies that one day I will need to give them up too and then I hardly imagine what would I even eat and it makes me anxious.


Answering the question about what do I usually eat in a day... well it depends. On bad days it can be just couple vegan cookies and coffee with oatmilk for the day. On good days when I can cook and eat normally it's usually still 1-2 meals a day but with snacks and I eat stuff like rice, oatmeal, pasta, make stuff from tofu, salads, fruits, potatoes. Sometimes vegan "meat" stuff, bread with vegan "butter", soups.

About the B12 stuff... well I couldn't really find affordable vegan supplements in my country, but the magnesium i take has a bit of B12 in it so I guess im fine for now...?

Also I'm very anxious about the medication for OCD since it's not vegan and I feel guilty about it

 

[chamomile]

One of the problems I'm seeing is a possibility of Orthorexia nervosa. I have seen YouTube videos where the "Clean Eating" protocols have devolved to the point that people have restricted their food down to the point that they LITERALLY starved to death.

"Orthorexia nervosa is an eating disorder that involves a fixation on healthy eating. A person with the disorder may focus so much on optimal nutrition that it impacts other aspects of their life."

I think before you make this journey you need to seek treatment for the OCD and eating disorder. You are doing something that is very dangerous.

Hey sorry for answering late, my phone broke so I wasnt able to respond while it was getting fixed

I'm not obsessed with healthy eating, I'm obsessed with ethics because some online vegan spaces make you feel like a monster even if you are already vegan, because some of vegan stuff you eat aren't very ethical. The eating disorder I mentioned was bulimia, and now I only relapse when people make comments about my food, and I'm scared to cook in front of certain people/ask my dad to buy me food cause I have a lot of shame and anxiety about the action of eating itself.

But basically as long as I think it's ethical and I'm alone i can eat unhealthy if i want I don't really care about the health part. I only started caring a bit when I went vegan cause my physical health is not very good and I was feeling even more weak than usual so I tried to make it more healthy to get proper nutrients and stuff

Like even now one of replies to this post said that I need to make my own juices and oatmilk, so people do think I'm wrong for buying it

 

[chamomile]

Hello there and welcome to the forum.

With regards to the food that you mention here are a few tips: fruit juices; you can make your own. Many shop brands don't use animal products in fruit juices so check the label. Buy coconut milk products made in Indonesia as they don't use monkeys. Fizzy drinks; buy plain fizzy water and add either fruit juice or fruit flavours. Coffee and chocolate; buy Fairtrade products as they are child labour free. I you have either health food or organic stores in your country you should be able to buy plant based milk/yogurts and tofu. You can also make your own oat milk.

Home page - Sojade

Sojade’s 100% organic, French and vegan products have been boosting your well-being daily since 2002. Try our plant-based range!

sojade.eu

The above French company exports to many European countries including the UK. You can usually find their products which are quite tasty and available in small independant health food stores.

Yeah I know i can make my own, but like I mentioned I'm mentally ill and often actively suicidal because of my ocd, so I can struggle to do simple everyday tasks not even talking about making my own juice and oatmilk.

Another thing is that to do so I will need to spend time in the kitchen and because of my eating disorder I'm scared to do food related stuff in front of others, also store bought plant milks usually already have vitamins in them if I make my own is not going to have them

When it comes to fizzy drink I almost don't drink them anymore cause it's not a big necessity.

I use coffee my family uses and nobody is going to buy fair trade just because I want to. I don't really eat a lot of chocolate anyway, only in vegan ice cream I found and some vegan chocolate spread.

There isn't a lot of vegan or fair trade stuff in my country, not even talking about both vegan and fair trade.

 

[chamomile]

So I read your post yesterday and my first response was not to answer it at all - your question or issue was just too difficult.

this morning when I woke up, your post was what I was thinking about. So to get if off my mind here goes.

But first I have to give kudos to SecondSummer who has provided you with a great answer. I wholeheartedly agree with everything he said. I don't want to repeat everything he said although most of what he says bears or deserves repeating.

you admit the decision to become vegan was quick and random and I believe that was a mistake. Being vegan is a big commitment and deserves a lot of thought and deliberation.

Also remaining vegan requires some research. There is information that you need and although much of it is in vegan subreddits, that is not the best way to acquire it.

The eating disorder and the OCD are big and real problems that need to be addressed. I'll touch on it here but really these issues required qualified personal that actually get to know you.

There are two problems with a person with an eating disorder becoming vegan. Two sides of the same coin. Here in the US there are articles in medical journals warning that an anorexic finds veganism a useful shield or camouflage for their disorder. The "oh I can't eat that" is basically what it comes down to. On the other side of the coin, the stress of just trying to be vegan can trigger anorexia.

So now for my advice. Be aware that free advice is worth what you pay for it.

You vegan journey stated like being shot out of a cannon. You need to back up and then start slower. Some of my favorite gurus say that you don't need to finish your research before you start but you do need to start your research before you start. Some of your issues are philosophical and are going to have flexible answers and solutions. But it's going to come down to How Vegan Do You Want To Be? Vegans call this Vegan Purity. For me the acid test is Does This Help The Animals". No one can be 100% vegan. So how vegan do you want to be Is 97% good enough. How about 91%. At school both of those get you an A.

I can't remember who said this but it has become a guiding principle in my life.
Perfection is the enemy of good.

How to go vegan

Overnight or gradual change? Top tips on how to go vegan.

www.vegansociety.com

Hey sorry for answering late, my phone broke so I wasnt able to respond while it was getting fixed

Basically I kinda did some of the reaserch before I went vegan, but like I did it more out of curiosity I wasn't planning on going vegan then, but then I started feeling guilty and thought like maybe I will try to just do a couple vegan days in a week at first, so then I tried and then I just thought like might as well go fully vegan.

And well during those 3 weeks of being vegan I did a ton of research, both on environmental effects, ethical and philosophical questions, and health part of it also. And I spend a bunch of time of vegan subreddit and it made me feel like I can't eat anything cause people here will hate on you even if you are vegan, because you are not vegan enough or not a perfect vegan, because you buy vegan stuff from a company that also sells dairy.

About the eating disorder part, I had severe bulimia in the past. But now it's not as bad, I still relapse sometimes with the puking part (sorry for gross details) but I do it only because of my dad's comments cause I can't even take a cucumber from the fridge without him telling something like "wow that's a lot of cucumber" and those comments send me into panic and give me the urge to throw out the food or threw it up if I already ate some. Also I'm scared to cook in front of some people, so sometimes i can't eat anything. But it was like this before I want vegan, the only difference is thay vegan diet requires way more cooking, so I can eat even less now.

But I can't stop being vegan now cause I'm not going to eat anything non vegan without guilt so I will try to deal with it somehow. It's just that it makes me anxious because literally nothing seems to be ethical, like it was already hard to become vegan in a country that isn't exactly vegan friendly. I was so exited when I was able to find at least some vegan products, and then I go on r/vegan and find out that I'm a monster because alpros oatmilk is unethical, chocolate is unethical, coffee is unethical, tofu can also be unethical, rice too, coconut stuff too..? Even juices aren't vegan cause they use isinglass. Also if I get prescribed OCD meds they aren't vegan also and I feel like a monster because I want the meds anyway cause my ocd is bad

 

[Second Summer]

MOD POST
This thread was closed as it became clear the OP really needs urgent professional help that we are obviously not capable of providing.

Thank you to everyone who tried to help in this thread, and I'm sorry that we can't allow the thread to remain open, but I hope you understand.

(The OP was contacted privately last night (UK time) to explain this.)