Searching for balance

[FoodMaster777]

Hello everyone,

My name is Frank, I´m from SA and I´ve actually tried an ovolactovegetarian diet twice already, the first time I developed a sort of anemia, so I´ve been taken B12 supplementation since then, it´s recommended no matter your food regime anyway. I didn´t stick to it the second time because I got bored of the meals and sometimes I didn´t have time to cook and since I practice gymnastics I was afraid that I wouldn´t get the proper nutrition in order for my body to maintain its performance level.

Still, I don´t eat read meat, I actually don´t like them really, so I could describe myself as a flexitarian, as infamous as it might sound to you. During this vacations I leveled up my cooking game and I planned an eating schedule for two weeks, and there are only 3 days out of 14 where I´m required to use chicken or fish for my recipes. I think that´s progress, and I hope as I keep getting better at this I can do more complex preparations to steer clear of meat whatsoever.

Also, I know its unethical and polluting, I´ve done my research. Let´s just say I´ve chosen to be a monster, for the time being. But I hope I can improve my techniques with the help of ya´ll.

Thanks for reading, I´m glad there exists a community like this one .

 

[Second Summer]

Welcome, and well done for your efforts.

I can imagine there could be some challenges for someone who is vegan or vegetarian in Colombia. I have it easy here in the UK with all kinds of vegan ready meals and speciality products.

Do you cook most of the food you eat yourself? I used to do that myself back in the day, so I know it can be very time consuming and exhausting. Do you have a freezer? If so, you can prepare meals in advance and freeze, which helps on busy days.

B12 supplementation is definitely very important, sorry to hear you developed anaemia before.

 

[Lou]

B12 supplementation is important for vegans. I'm not so sure it's that important for Flexatarians who eat some meat. The human body is very good at storing B12. But it might be a good idea to keep taking the B12 supplement.

Anemia is not from a B12 deficiency although maybe B12 has a role in iron abosorbtion. I know Vitamin C does. Anemia is very common in vegans AND non-vegans. I used to be borderline anemic constantly. The best bet is to find a couple of iron rich foods and add them to your diet. As a vegan I already got plenty of beans and greens, so I added apricots as a snack. Almost any dried fruit will work. But be careful - they have a lot of calories.

As far as your cooking shedule goes, maybe you could eliminate one of the non-vegan meals each month. Tofu makes for a great chicken replacement - you can probably use the same recipe but with tofu instead. I don't know what you can do for fish - try googling it. I just did and spotted some interesting ideas.

As far as schedules go. Have you ever tried bulk food preparation. It's where you take an evening and make all your meals for the week. There are books, articles, and videos on it. I thought we had a thread on it. but I can't find it. Let me know if you are interested in that.

 

[Emma JC]

welcome to the forum and it is good that you are choosing to be aware of your choices

Be sure to eat enough calories, as you are athletic, and if lots of those calories come from potatoes and rice and root veggies and beans etc then that is okay too. Lots of protein in vegetables and legumes.

I wish you great success in your journey and hope we can be of help to you.

Emma JC
Find your vegan soulmate or just a friend. www.spiritualmatchmaking.com

 

[Second Summer]

Anemia is not from a B12 deficiency although maybe B12 has a role in iron abosorbtion.

There is a certain kind of anaemia that comes from B12 deficiency. It is called B12 deficiency anaemia or vitamin deficiency anaemia.

Vitamin deficiency anemia-Vitamin deficiency anemia - Symptoms & causes - Mayo Clinic

A lack of folate and vitamin B-12 can cause a type of anemia in which red blood cells become too large and can't carry oxygen properly.

www.mayoclinic.org

 

[FoodMaster777]

Thank you both for taking the time, I´ll expand a little on my schedule: I always have the same breakfast, some carbo with eggs plus oats with soy beverage and some dried fruits, be it peanuts, almonds or walnuts. I try to eat five pieces of fruits + vegetables a day. I´ve seen this meal prep thing actually, but I find it too difficult because I eat a lot, like I would eat two portions for one meal, and the thing is I have for dinner the same as I had for lunch; so I would still have to cook at nights so I find it quicker just to make my breakfast and lunch everyday. I don´t like processed foods at all, so I do mostly all of it myself, maybe eat from a restaurant once in a while, but not processed. I´ve tried tofu but haven´t got the touch, it´s a demanding item to cook with, apparently it was never tasty when I prepared it because you need to knead it and stuff; I use texturized soy though, it´s got more protein than meat even, but I don´t find it as practical.

 

[FoodMaster777]

welcome to the forum and it is good that you are choosing to be aware of your choices

Be sure to eat enough calories, as you are athletic, and if lots of those calories come from potatoes and rice and root veggies and beans etc then that is okay too. Lots of protein in vegetables and legumes.

I wish you great success in your journey and hope we can be of help to you.

Emma JC
Find your vegan soulmate or just a friend. www.spiritualmatchmaking.com

Thanks, actually I don´t count calories but a large part of my diet is rice, like, it´s what fuels me, and since I use all of that energy I´m not afraid to get overweight or something, it´s balanced.

 

[Second Summer]

Do you drink calcium-fortified plant milks? It's a good source of calcium. (I assume you can get similar amounts from dairy milk if you still drink that, though.)

I use fortified soya milk with my breakfast oatmeal, and I usually also drink a glass of Oatly every day.

 

[FoodMaster777]

Do you drink calcium-fortified plant milks? It's a good source of calcium. (I assume you can get similar amounts from dairy milk if you still drink that, though.)

I use fortified soya milk with my breakfast oatmeal, and I usually also drink a glass of Oatly every day.

Yes, the soy milk I drink is fortified with lots of vitamins but I don´t like calling it milk. I don´t drink milk really, except for maybe a piece of cake or preparing some curry since they don´t sell coocnut milk in my local groceries store.

 

[Lou]

There is a certain kind of anaemia that comes from B12 deficiency. It is called B12 deficiency anaemia or vitamin deficiency anaemia.

Vitamin deficiency anemia-Vitamin deficiency anemia - Symptoms & causes - Mayo Clinic

A lack of folate and vitamin B-12 can cause a type of anemia in which red blood cells become too large and can't carry oxygen properly.

www.mayoclinic.org

Just looked at those symptoms. I have all of them!

 

[Second Summer]

Just looked at those symptoms. I have all of them!

Ouch Maybe time to consult a doctor and get an injection? Absorption of B12 can become less effective as we grow older.

 

[Lou]

Ouch Maybe time to consult a doctor and get an injection? Absorption of B12 can become less effective as we grow older.

Actually I said that tongue in cheek. If you look at the list of the symptoms - most are pretty common for any senior citizen. but I don't have yellow skin or numbness, or irregular heart beat.

I used to rely on just fortified foods, then I went to 1000Mg once a week. Recently upped it to every other day.

Maybe I should go every day?

I'm getting some blood work and a physical in a couple of months. I'll bring it up then.

 

[silva]

Just looked at those symptoms. I have all of them!

Wow, those are nothing to ignore, regardless of cause!
What kind and how much/often do you take?
Dr Gregers recommendtions for over 65 is 1000 mcg daily

 

[Second Summer]

Actually I said that tongue in cheek. If you look at the list of the symptoms - most are pretty common for any senior citizen. but I don't have yellow skin or numbness, or irregular heart beat.

Whew, I was worried there for a bit!

I used to rely on just fortified foods, then I went to 1000Mg once a week. Recently upped it to every other day.

Maybe I should go every day?

veganhealth.org (Jack Norris et al) recommends 50 to 100 µg per day or 1,000 µg at least twice per week for older adults with normal B12 status.

B12 Status of Older Vegetarians

The latest blog post from VeganHealth.org

veganhealth.org

 

[Lou]

Wow, those are nothing to ignore, regardless of cause!
What kind and how much/often do you take?
Dr Gregers recommendtions for over 65 is 1000 mcg daily

I take 1000 every other day.
I also get a good amount from soy milk. Those smaller amounts in food are the most effective as far as absorbability. so I didn't think I needed the 1000/day.
maybe I'll do that anyway.
but like I said what senior doesn't suffer a little bit from

• Fatigue
• Personality changes
• Unsteady movements
• Mental confusion or forgetfulnes

 

[Lou]

Whew, I was worried there for a bit!

veganhealth.org (Jack Norris et al) recommends 50 to 100 µg per day or 1,000 µg at least twice per week for older adults with normal B12 status.

B12 Status of Older Vegetarians

The latest blog post from VeganHealth.org

veganhealth.org

From soy milk alone I get 3mcg 2 or 3 times a day*. and more from tofu and other things a few times a week

also the 1000 mcg three times a week.


* frequent low dosages are the most absorbable. 30 - 50%. as compared to high doses that are only like 1% absorbed.

 

[FoodMaster777]

From soy milk alone I get 3mcg 2 or 3 times a day*. and more from tofu and other things a few times a week

also the 1000 mcg three times a week.


* frequent low dosages are the most absorbable. 30 - 50%. as compared to high doses that are only like 1% absorbed.

Is your tofu fortified or something? Why would soy naturally have B12? You know this vitamin is sintesized by a bacteria in the dirt, right?

 

[Lou]

Is your tofu fortified or something?

Good call. Some tofu is fortified. Its made from soy milk and if the soy milk is fortified then....
but not all are. I usually check the labels but lately I've been just buying the least expensive organic tofu that is in the store. Just checked the two that I have in the freezer - both are unfortified.

Why would soy naturally have B12?

Soy does not naturally have B12. but most soy milks are fortified with vitamins and minerals to make it similar nutritionally to cow's milk. Silk adds Calcium Carbonate, Vitamin A Palmitate, Vitamin D2, Riboflavin [B2], Vitamin B12),

And I just found this article which is pretty interesting.

13 Vegan Foods and Drinks Fortified With B12

Need more vitamin B12 in your diet but don't want to take a supplement? Try out these 14 foods and beverages infused with B12 and never worry again!

www.onegreenplanet.org

If I understand it correctly, one of the best ways to get B12 is with 3 - 5 servings of fortified food a day.

You know this vitamin is sintesized by a bacteria in the dirt, right?

Most of the B12 non vegans consume is syntehezied in the gut of cows.

Most of the B12 vegans consume is synthesized in vats of bacteria.

Soil bacteria has a very small role in providing B12 to us. Mostly our soil is depleted of cobalt which the bacteria requires to make B12. Plus our vegetables are super clean and probably have no soil on them.

Home garden vegetables might be different.

Maybe the soil bacteria plays a role in maintaining the levels of bacteria in a cows stomach. but I simply speculate. I also think that diary cows that don't graze but just eat TMR, the TMR is fortified - but I don't know with what.

I have heard vegans who proponent the theory that we are not natural omnivores claim that our ancestors got B12 from eating root vegetables. or maybe dirty water. I have no idea if this is true or if you could prove it. Might be a good thing to explore and experiment.

Scientists who track homo sapiens migration have found that human migration and expansion mostly follows waterways and coastlines. shell fish which are not at all challenging to catch and eat are a great source of B12.

 

[silva]

Soil bacteria has a very small role in providing B12 to us. Mostly our soil is depleted of cobalt which the bacteria requires to make B12. Plus our vegetables are super clean and probably have no soil on them.

Home garden vegetables might be different.

Maybe the soil bacteria plays a role in maintaining the levels of bacteria in a cows stomach. but I simply speculate. I also think that diary cows that don't graze but just eat TMR, the TMR is fortified - but I don't know with what.

I have heard vegans who proponent the theory that we are not natural omnivores claim that our ancestors got B12 from eating root vegetables. or maybe dirty water. I have no idea if this is true or if you could prove it. Might be a good thing to explore and experiment.

B12 is in soil from animal feces, so you would need to have roaming animals or add manure.
TMR?
I've always read most B12 was obtained from untreated water

 

[Lou]

Good call. Some tofu is fortified. Its made from soy milk and if the soy milk is fortified then....
but not all are. I usually check the labels but lately I've been just buying the least expensive organic tofu that is in the store. Just checked the two that I have in the freezer - both are unfortified.

Soy does not naturally have B12. but most soy milks are fortified with vitamins and minerals to make it similar nutritionally to cow's milk. Silk adds Calcium Carbonate, Vitamin A Palmitate, Vitamin D2, Riboflavin [B2], Vitamin B12),

And I just found this article which is pretty interesting.

13 Vegan Foods and Drinks Fortified With B12

Need more vitamin B12 in your diet but don't want to take a supplement? Try out these 14 foods and beverages infused with B12 and never worry again!

www.onegreenplanet.org

If I understand it correctly, one of the best ways to get B12 is with 3 - 5 servings of fortified food a day.




Soil bacteria has a very small role in providing B12 to us. Mostly our soil is depleted of cobalt which the bacteria requires to make B12. Plus our vegetables are super clean and probably have no soil on them.
Home garden vegetables might be different.
Maybe the soil bacteria plays a role in maintaining the levels of bacteria in a cows stomach. but I simply speculate. I also think that diary cows that don't graze but just eat TMR, the TMR is fortified - but I don't know with what.

I have heard vegans who proponent the theory that we are not natural omnivores claim that our ancestors got B12 from eating root vegetables. or maybe dirty water. I have no idea if this is true or if you could prove it. Might be a good thing to explore and experiment.

Scientists who track homo sapiens migration have found that human migration and expansion mostly follows waterways and coastlines. shell fish which are not at all challenging to catch and eat are a great source of B12.

B12 is in soil from animal feces, so you would need to have roaming animals or add manure.

I thought it occurred naturally too, like on the roots of some plants. but maybe I have that mixed up with something else.

TMR?

Sorry, I should have explained. Its jargon. Total Mixed Rations.

Feeding a total mixed ration (TMR) that contains all the feeds and nutrients the cow needs is an effective, efficient and profitable way to feed dairy cows.
Managing TMR daily can make sure your cows receive enough nutrients for good health, milk production and reproduction.
Basically its Cow Kibble.
I think when we see those pics of dairy cows eating at a trough - That is TMR.

I've always read most B12 was obtained from untreated water

I've often thought of that as a myth but you know if you were at a lake that had bacteria in it then maybe it would also have b12 in it. Since we need so little b12 and we drink so much water - maybe we could get B12 from lake water.
but you know if it has B12 creating bacteria - what other bacteria does it have?
and then you run the risk of getting cholera, diarrhoea, dysentery, hepatitis A, and typhoid

But back in the day - that was all there was.