Natural flavoring/flavors-vegan food labeling

Noda

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Hi. Is anyone here able to tell 100 % sure if the natural flavors in foods that carry the official vegan label/sign are 100% always plant based and never from animals. I've asked several vegan societies, even Veganz and Peta, but not a single answer from anyone.

Maybe someone here can answer?
 
Hi. Is anyone here able to tell 100 % sure if the natural flavors in foods that carry the official vegan label/sign are 100% always plant based and never from animals. I've asked several vegan societies, even Veganz and Peta, but not a single answer from anyone.

Maybe someone here can answer?

I Noda, welcome to the vegan forum, I'm fairly new here too.

I'm a bit confused also especially with sugar, palm oil & coconut oil.

White Cane sugar is purified using the bones of animals (bone char), so not from animals but used in the manufacture.
Beet sugar is OK

Palm oil despite the fake RSPO labelling causes habitat loss and humans deliberately murder the animals to stop them from interfering with the crop

Coconut oil - In Thailand they use monkeys to collect the coconuts - they are abused and kept chained up, it's horrific. There doesn't seem to be any labeling for coconut oil sources.

I posted this link on another thread. Vegan Certifications, Animal Testing Claims, and more - Double Check Vegan

As you can see - the certified vegan - label mentions the bone char issue. You can buy packet sugar in the uk from certain brands that don't use bone char but who knows what the source of sugar is in processed food.

Also a lot of the fake cheeses and margerines use palm oil and coconut oil.

In the UK there is a supermarket called ICELAND which launched a campaign to stop using palm oil in their products with a heart warming/breaking advert ...


... but have now gone back on their word because of financial reasons. If the RSPO labeling was worth anything they would have just used RSPO palm oil in the first place but they didn't.

I'm trying to just go Whole Foods Plant Based (wfpb) myself so I never have to worry about these things.

I hope this helps somewhat with your question.
 
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I Noda, welcome to the vegan forum, I'm fairly new here too.

I'm a bit confused also especially with sugar, palm oil & coconut oil.

White Cane sugar is purified using the bones of animals (bone char), so not from animals but used in the manufacture.
Beet sugar is OK

Palm oil despite the fake RSPO labelling causes habitat loss and humans deliberately murder the animals to stop them from interfering with the crop

Coconut oil - In Thailand they use monkeys to collect the coconuts - they are abused and kept chained up, it's horrific. There doesn't seem to be any labeling for coconut oil sources.

I posted this link on another thread. Vegan Certifications, Animal Testing Claims, and more - Double Check Vegan

As you can see - the certified vegan - label mentions the bone char issue. You can buy packet sugar in the uk from certain brands that don't use bone char but who knows what the source of sugar is in processed food.

Also a lot of the fake cheeses and margerines use palm oil and coconut oil.

We are a bit off topic here as the OP has asked a question with regards to natural vegan flavourings. If the label doesn't state vegan or have the vegan logo it may not be cruelty free. Some naturals colours such as cochenal use crushed insects.

Sugar in the UK: It is vegan.


Palm oil:

I would have preferred to use another source of information but the following link is quite detailed. If a product contains
palm oil; it is listed in the ingredients. However, many food items also state 'Contains no palm oil'. There are numerous food products that do NOT contain palm oil including cheeze:

Packshot-450g-regular.png



Coconut Product:

I only buy Kara products (the tastiest too) as this brand (coconut from Bali) does not use monkeys to harvest the nuts: If in doubt don't purchase the product. All products that are made in Thailand are NOT cruelty free:


 
Roy R and Shyvas, thank you.

Although I have not exactly got the answer to my question, I've still learnt something new from each of you.

Shyvas, you were going in the right direction, but I'd actually already known that. I am trying to find out if I see a food item in a shop and there is a label stating that the product is vegan, can I be 100%sure, that the manufacturer did not get the aroma, the natural flavoring listed in their ingredients from animal sources?

How come sometimes a vegan tuna or vegan soy pieces or pulled chunks with chicken taste/flavour taste so scary like real tuna or chicken. Or Vegan prosciutto? Do they collect the flavourings during possessing the meat (cooking, baking, smoking, .)?

I have bought a package of wafers in Spar. The label states vegan. Wafers with cocoa creme and milk aroma. What exactly does that mean? Where does the milk aroma come from? How did they get it? I've tried one, since it is labeled vegan and it does taste like milk. Very much so. The manufacturer is not listed on the package. It is under the Spar label. I've spent a few hours trying to find out who makes them. No way.

Thanks to you I have checked the ingredients on the package and the first ingredient listed is palm oil. No info on the origin.

If the label says vegan and palm oil is an ingredient, does it guarantee that it is cruelty free or the institutions which give out the vegan labels just don't give a damn about that?

Since you've discussed sugars as well. If there is a product with a label stating that the product is BIO /organic but the sugar in it is cane sugar, is it safe to assume that the sugar was not purified by using bone char?
How about if all above is the same, but the label states vegan?

Is raw cane sugar vegan? Always?
Is cane sugar (not raw) by default always purified with bone char?

Sadly, Kara products are not available here.

And just 2 more question: Do you eat cherries and figs? Do you consider them vegan? I would eat sour cherries, but I can't even think of eating cherries. When they are at their best and taste so wonderful I just can't be sure if there is a worm inside it or not. If I was gambling and had to choose 50-50 on a random cherry, I would choose that there is a worm inside.

Lately I've been extremely tired. How do you keep your health in tact? Do you supplement vegan D3, Omegas, B12?

I hope I am not too demanding or annoying here by asking all these questions . It's just so darn confusing when you are trying to be a true vegan.

Have a lovely day.
 
Roy R and Shyvas, thank you.

Although I have not exactly got the answer to my question, I've still learnt something new from each of you.

Shyvas, you were going in the right direction, but I'd actually already known that. I am trying to find out if I see a food item in a shop and there is a label stating that the product is vegan, can I be 100%sure, that the manufacturer did not get the aroma, the natural flavoring listed in their ingredients from animal sources?

How come sometimes a vegan tuna or vegan soy pieces or pulled chunks with chicken taste/flavour taste so scary like real tuna or chicken. Or Vegan prosciutto? Do they collect the flavourings during possessing the meat (cooking, baking, smoking, .)?

I have bought a package of wafers in Spar. The label states vegan. Wafers with cocoa creme and milk aroma. What exactly does that mean? Where does the milk aroma come from? How did they get it? I've tried one, since it is labeled vegan and it does taste like milk. Very much so. The manufacturer is not listed on the package. It is under the Spar label. I've spent a few hours trying to find out who makes them. No way.

Thanks to you I have checked the ingredients on the package and the first ingredient listed is palm oil. No info on the origin.

If the label says vegan and palm oil is an ingredient, does it guarantee that it is cruelty free or the institutions which give out the vegan labels just don't give a damn about that?

Since you've discussed sugars as well. If there is a product with a label stating that the product is BIO /organic but the sugar in it is cane sugar, is it safe to assume that the sugar was not purified by using bone char?
How about if all above is the same, but the label states vegan?

Is raw cane sugar vegan? Always?
Is cane sugar (not raw) by default always purified with bone char?

Sadly, Kara products are not available here.

And just 2 more question: Do you eat cherries and figs? Do you consider them vegan? I would eat sour cherries, but I can't even think of eating cherries. When they are at their best and taste so wonderful I just can't be sure if there is a worm inside it or not. If I was gambling and had to choose 50-50 on a random cherry, I would choose that there is a worm inside.

Lately I've been extremely tired. How do you keep your health in tact? Do you supplement vegan D3, Omegas, B12?

I hope I am not too demanding or annoying here by asking all these questions . It's just so darn confusing when you are trying to be a true vegan.

Have a lovely day.

Perhaps you should look up the Vegan Society's webpage as they have some very useful information for people who want to become vegans:

 
I hope I am not too demanding or annoying here by asking all these questions . It's just so darn confusing when you are trying to be a true vegan.

I think the best you can go by is to trust the labeling as far as you can - With regards to my previous link - the vegan society label doesn't account for animal products used to make the final product i.e. the whole bone char issue. Having said that, the sentence does read as follows :- the processing aids used in the manufacturing process are vegan So this may account for the products used to clarify sugar and wines etc. in the same way as the statement made by vegan.org.

But then some products that contain the vegan label also contain palm and coconut oil?

There are probably processed products out there that are also vegan but they just haven't bothered to do the certification.

I don't really miss the cheese / margerine spreads anymore so I don't buy them and they are REALLY not very healthy and very easy to get carried away with, but I do still check every now and then if the more popular brands are still using palm and coconut oil but doubt I'll every buy them again anyway for health reasons not vegan reasons.

I couldn't find the cheeze brand mentioned by Shyvas but there is a brand called sheese which uses coconut oil but there is no mention of it's source. This brand is in most of our supermarkets and easy to get hold of. The supermarkets also do their own brands but again they contain mainly coconut oil with no mention of the source.

I'm glad you learnt something new even though it was a bit "off topic" as that was my intention with regards to the oils.

With regards to the feeling tired bit, how long have you been vegan, it could be that your body is detoxifying and maybe causing the tiredness. I very rarely take the B12 but I still try to when I remember. I remember watching a video by Gary Yourofsky who stated that he never takes it but maybe it's best to be on the safe side.

The 'food' industry have been purposely injecting it into animals and supplementing cereals with it which suggests there is some government mandate to do this to keep us sufficient in it (even though we are mainly still not - meat eater or vegan )

Omega 3's can be gained from Ground Chia and Flax seed apparently, I put them in smoothies, I've heard Spirulina is also a source but I heard someone the other day say it has issues and they were recommending Chlorella instead.

Vitamin D - get out in the sun more - if you can. Getting sun through a window has NO effect they say.

I've never been tired as a vegan or before for that matter - I've never experienced an increase in energy as a result of not eating meat but i didn't go vegan for diet reasons and so wasn't expecting to however the process was a bit more gradual for me (over a couple of months), I wasn't ever expecting to call myself a vegan but capitulated when after cutting out various bit's and pieces after learning what was involved, I realised my principles in the end where the same as vegans. I still used to eat vegan junk food but have nearly cut it all out now. Raw food seems to be the way to go from what I've been reading as the enzymes are not destroyed during the cooking process and thus you get more nutrients in you and even need to eat less.

Look up any information about the gut microbiome - it's fascinating.
 
Short answer. Just trust the label.

------

Long answer. IMHO, No one can really be 100% vegan. So it's just how far you want to go.

It's certainly easy enough to just buy Certified Vegan products.
And it doesn't take much effort to avoid palm oil and coconut product. However keep in mind that not all palm oil comes from rainforest destroying plantations. Not all coconuts are harvested by monkeys.
You'll have to do your homework on palm oil and coconuts. Fortunately we have discussed those things in other threads.

Personally I'm very convinced that we need to supplement (somehow) for Vitamin B12. Most of us should supplement D as well. and it wouldn't hurt to go with Omega 3 too. I'm not so sure you can get enough omega 3 from just flaxseeds.
 
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First lets get the sugar straitened out--
Bone Char-Free Sugar Brands in 2023 [Vegan List]
Here's a Quick Way to Learn About the Top 20 Sweeteners.
I can't find a comprehensive list of countries that use or not, but it's not used in the UK, Australia or New Zealand
Maybe someone else can provide a link

As to whether a product labeled vegan necessarily meets vegan standards depends on which label is used, and the country where it's manufactured pretty stringent, and carries a cost, to have this label, and I do trust it--

I am not that stringent myself. I base what I choose on most good rather than personal purity
 
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I couldn't find the cheeze brand mentioned by Shyvas but there is a brand called sheese which uses coconut oil but there is no mention of it's source.
This brand is in most of our supermarkets and easy to get hold of. The supermarkets also do their own brands but again they contain mainly coconut oil with no mention of the source.

 
First lets get the sugar straitened out--
You guys don't seem to understand what I am trying to point out.

I'm not talking about buying sugar in packet form - I understand that there are sugar products out their that don't use bone char especially in the UK.

I am talking about the sugar that has been added to processed food. This is where the confusion is for me.

Plus I have already pointed out the "Certified Vegan" certification form vegan.org which clearly states that their certified products don't contain ingredients used for the manufacture of products i.e. bone char and finings (see my original response to Noda above) so I already understand this.

I am stringent - If I know that something has involved animal exploitation I will avoid it especially after the fact that "now I know" in the same way that I went vegan in the first place. There are obviously some things that you just cannot avoid of course.

It is not about personal purity and not putting animal products in my body it's about not lining the pockets of businesses whose bottom line is money at the end of the day. Full credit to actual vegan companies but most of them are a business capitalising on a niche market - until they get big enough to sell out to a company that also sells products of animal abuse which makes you question their motives in the first place. Having said that it's better than nothing and if it helps people transition then that's great for the animals.

Each to their own I suppose but all I am trying to do is highlight a possible issue and not find loopholes to eating something that I possibly shouldn't and don't have to!
 
You guys don't seem to understand what I am trying to point out.

I'm not talking about buying sugar in packet form - I understand that there are sugar products out their that don't use bone char especially in the UK.

I am talking about the sugar that has been added to processed food. This is where the confusion is for me.

Plus I have already pointed out the "Certified Vegan" certification form vegan.org which clearly states that their certified products don't contain ingredients used for the manufacture of products i.e. bone char and finings (see my original response to Noda above) so I already understand this.

I am stringent - If I know that something has involved animal exploitation I will avoid it especially after the fact that "now I know" in the same way that I went vegan in the first place. There are obviously some things that you just cannot avoid of course.

It is not about personal purity and not putting animal products in my body it's about not lining the pockets of businesses whose bottom line is money at the end of the day. Full credit to actual vegan companies but most of them are a business capitalising on a niche market - until they get big enough to sell out to a company that also sells products of animal abuse which makes you question their motives in the first place. Having said that it's better than nothing and if it helps people transition then that's great for the animals.

Each to their own I suppose but all I am trying to do is highlight a possible issue and not find loopholes to eating something that I possibly shouldn't and don't have to!

If you are buying processed pb food that has been manufactured either in the UK or within Europe it will not contain bone char.

I'm not too sure of why you are confused as if sugar is added to a product made in the UK, logically it'll be made with a UK sugar brand.
 
If you are buying processed pb food that has been manufactured either in the UK or within Europe it will not contain bone char.

I'm not too sure of why you are confused as if sugar is added to a product made in the UK, logically it'll be made with a UK sugar brand.
Ok well if that is true then that's great - I didn't know that ALL sugar in the UK was ok but only some brands like for example Tate and Lyle so it's not logical at all just an assumption - companies will go for the cheapest product they can which is why they use palm oil in everything.

Where have you got the verification from, or has someone just told you that?
 
Ok well if that is true then that's great - I didn't know that ALL sugar in the UK was ok but only some brands like for example Tate and Lyle so it's not logical at all just an assumption - companies will go for the cheapest product they can which is why they use palm oil in everything.

Where have you got the verification from, or has someone just told you that?

It's a well known fact that sugar in the UK (as in most of Europe) is vegan. If it weren't the case, most vegans wouldn't buy
ice cream and cakes from bakeries, cafés and restaurants.

"In the UK, there are only 3 sugar producers: Tate & Lyle, British sugar (brands such as Silver Spoon) & Ragus Sugars. None of the 3 companies use bone char for processing, meaning all granulated and caster sugar in the UK is suitable for vegans.''

Is Sugar Vegan in the UK?.

Other products that may not be vegan:

 
Ok well if that is true then that's great - I didn't know that ALL sugar in the UK was ok but only some brands like for example Tate and Lyle so it's not logical at all just an assumption - companies will go for the cheapest product they can which is why they use palm oil in everything.

Where have you got the verification from, or has someone just told you that?
OK I've managed to do some more research and it would appear that the reason that sugar in the UK is naturally vegan is because we use Beet Sugar.
It's a well known fact that sugar in the UK (as in most of Europe) is vegan. If it weren't the case, most vegans wouldn't buy
ice cream and cakes from bakeries, cafés and restaurants.

"In the UK, there are only 3 sugar producers: Tate & Lyle, British sugar (brands such as Silver Spoon) & Ragus Sugars. None of the 3 companies use bone char for processing, meaning all granulated and caster sugar in the UK is suitable for vegans.''

Is Sugar Vegan in the UK?.

Other products that may not be vegan:


Yes I've seen all of those links which talk about buying packets of sugar which was not what i was originally concerned about.

I don't think MOST vegans know about sugar potentially being non vegan and thus affecting their purchasing of cakes and ice cream - I would think it's more the dairy and eggs that they would be thinking about. Do vegans then avoid vegan cakes without a dusting of icing sugar (which is not vegan because of the egg white) or even some icing I wonder?

Anyway - I've done some more research and it would appear that the reason why UK sugar is vegan is because we use beet sugar grown in the UK which doesn't require the use of bone char according to all the research I've done. It looks like British Sugar which buy all of the beet sugar in the UK has the biggest refinery and all of them too but again - HOPEFULLY products made in the UK are using UK sugar (Tate & Lyle, British Sugar).

Unlike the fact that products in the UK don't use UK palm oil (when and if they use it in their products and because there is no such thing of course) but import it because it's cheaper than using UK grown vegetable oil a la ICELAND foods.
 
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I couldn't find the cheeze brand mentioned by Shyvas but there is a brand called sheese which uses coconut oil but there is no mention of it's source. This brand is in most of our supermarkets and easy to get hold of. The supermarkets also do their own brands but again they contain mainly coconut oil with no mention of the source.

I asked Sheese (Bute Island) and here is there response:

Thanks for reaching out, I appreciate this has been very topical recently but, I would like to reassure you we are very careful about the sourcing of our coconut. Our coconut comes from Indonesia and the Philippines and is harvested using humanitarian ethics and environmentally friendly methods. Absolutely no monkeys, or any other animals are used to harvest coconuts for our production.


Thanks

Al.
 
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OK I've managed to do some more research and it would appear that the reason that sugar in the UK is naturally vegan is because we use Beet Sugar.


Yes I've seen all of those links which talk about buying packets of sugar which was not what i was originally concerned about.

I don't think MOST vegans know about sugar potentially being non vegan and thus affecting their purchasing of cakes and ice cream - I would think it's more the dairy and eggs that they would be thinking about. Do vegans then avoid vegan cakes without a dusting of icing sugar (which is not vegan because of the egg white) or even some icing I wonder?

Anyway - I've done some more research and it would appear that the reason why UK sugar is vegan is because we use beet sugar grown in the UK which doesn't require the use of bone char according to all the research I've done. It looks like British Sugar which buy all of the beet sugar in the UK has the biggest refinery and all of them too but again - HOPEFULLY products made in the UK are using UK sugar (Tate & Lyle, British Sugar).

Unlike the fact that products in the UK don't use UK palm oil (when and if they use it in their products and because there is no such thing of course) but import it because it's cheaper than using UK grown vegetable oil a la ICELAND foods.

Icing sugar (UK & Europe) is vegan. It's Royal Icing (made with icing sugar) that contains egg whites.

You also asked a question (can't find it) about faux meat and smoked flavours. The latter isn't obtained by cooking meat but by smoking a product in either a smoker using wood chips or by using a spice such as chipotle or liquid smoke.

If the finished product has the Vegan label you can trust it be 100 % vegan.

It's very easy to avoid processed with that contains palm oil, as it's listed on the packet. Many manufacturers also state
'without palm oil'.
 
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Icing sugar (UK & Europe) is vegan. It's Royal Icing (made with icing sugar) that contains egg whites.

You also asked a question (can't find it) about faux meat and smoked flavours. The latter isn't obtained by cooking meat but by smoking a product in either a smoker using wood chips or by using a spice such as chipotle or liquid smoke.

If the finished product has the Vegan label you can trust it be 100 % vegan.

It's very easy to avoid processed with that contains palm oil, as it's listed on the packet. Many manufacturers also state
'without palm oil'.
I got the icing sugar reference from your BBC link.

It was the OP who was asking about the meat flavours.

Well hopefully brands with Vegan labeling and contain Palm oil are ethical - I was reading the website from your shea butter product and they seem to think that 85% of palm oil production is unethical. It's a shame that the Vegan label doesn't explicitly state this (that palm oil on their certificated product is ok) on their website though regardless of RSPO labels.

Nice one for writing to Bute Island though! I hope I don't get lured back into buying it now otherwise my waistline is going to suffer.