Is being vegan an all or nothing thing?

[Poppy]

I thought this was a very interesting article, and I'd be curious to know whether VVers agree or disagree. Over time, I think I've become more relaxed in my expectations of other vegans. It's been my experience that vegans online tend to be more "hard core" than those I meet in real life, so I don't make comments or criticize when I suspect they've bent the "rules" , but perhaps my experiences have been unique.


Why being vegan is NOT an all-or-nothing thing

 

[Danielle]

If you're purposely buying animal products, that's obviously not vegan

 

[PTree15]

I haven't met many vegans IRL (save for the VVers I've met in person who are awesome ); I've mostly met vegetarians. That said, I appreciate any effort someone makes toward living an animal-cruelty-free life, and while I agree that people IRL might have very different interpretations of what is "possible and practicable," eating cheese, for example, isn't vegan, IMHO, and I would say as much if someone IRL claimed to be vegan but still was eating cheese or eggs or yogurt or some other food they simply can't give up. I suppose people's standards are different? While I might not give somebody a pass for eating cheese, I might not say anything if they're still wearing leather shoes, because maybe they are transitioning or something, or they feel like they can't replace them yet because they aren't in a financial position to do so.

Still, sometimes I think people want to tailor or appropriate a definition of veganism to make it fit into their lives and thus not feel guilty if they aren't "perfect," but regardless of the "degrees" of what is possible and practicable, I agree with Danielle, that if you're intentionally consuming any animal products (or any byproducts, for that matter) that you could really do without, it's not vegan. I understand that it's almost impossible to really live without impacting the lives of animals, but if you're truly giving it the old college try, cheese is not really an option.

I hope that makes some sense and that I don't sound like some judgmental, self-righteous vegan, lol. I've had a couple of glasses of (vegan) wine, and I might be a little less than organized than usual in my thought patterns.

 

[Naturebound1]

I can see where there are grey areas. For example, there are vegans who have companion dogs and cats and feed them animal based food for a number of reasons. There are vegans who choose to get the flu shot even though most of them have an egg component. There are vegans who buy products with cane sugar that more than likely was made using bone char.

I usually don't judge people for these types of decisions. We are not living in a perfect world. I would however, take issue with someone calling themselves vegan but choosing to consume an egg or dairy product "here and there" that is completely unnecessary (and one could argue that a product with cane sugar isn't necessary either but it is such a minute amount and not directly involved in suffering as opposed to egg or cheese). It isn't really about being a vegan saint. It's that the meaning of veganism gets eroded when people start making blatant allowances that are completely unnecessary or where safe alternatives are available and attainable.

I've met vegans in real like that are both militant and laid back. People tend to be more polite face to face though.

 

[robert99]

It isn't really about being a vegan saint

Is there a vegan pope and can I apply for it?
Being vegan means doing the best you can.

 

[Naturebound1]

Is there a vegan pope and can I apply for it?
Bring vegan means doing the best you can.

 

[Jamie in Chile]

I think it is not an all or nothing thing. Some of you and others online (I can't recall having a meaningful conversation with a vegan in real life about veganism) seem quite harsh infact about where you draw the line about being a vegan but wherever it is is obviously arbitrary and a grey area.

 

[MadamSarcastra]

I'm just a mere vegetarian, but a very strict one. I no longer eat eggs (haven't for many, many months), except they're an ingredient in the ranch dressing I buy (hangs head in shame).... Man, I really need to make my own ranch one of these days. LMAO

I have 2 teaspoons of organic hazelnut creamer in my coffee every day.... I consume SOME cheese, not every day (drastic change from the crazy cheese-fiend I was just a couple years ago), but only cheeses with vegetarian or microbial enzymes, meaning no animal rennet, and preferably organic & grass-fed.

I won't wear leather anything any more... even changed out my old purse for a cloth one. I need to get a different wallet, however... when mine was stolen, I had to resort to using an old American Tourister leather wallet as a replacement, and I feel like a damn hypocrite carrying it around.

I dunno... I think I may lean more towards the vegan side of vegetarianism, if that makes any sense at all.... LOL

 

[Poppy]

There's a gal I've come to know on FB and IRL who works for Vegan Action - the company that owns the logo and certifies vegan food as being "certified vegan", which is here in Richmond. She also has a part-time job in the customer service department of one of our local grocery stores. Of course, every single time I run into her at the store, my cart contains some non-vegan products - mac & cheese Lean Cuisine, ice cream, sour cream and onion potato chips - all of which I buy for my daughter or husband (thank goodness no one here eats meat! ). It drives me crazy that she might think I'm a big hypocrite, and yet I'm not - so should I really care? It's an interesting dilemma.

 

[Calliegirl]

I kind of know how you feel. I'm embarrassed when I have to buy meat and cheese for my roommate. I always make it a point to tell the deli person the meat is not for me as if she cares who it's for.

I wouldn't worry though. If she thought you were a hypocrite, she would probably ask you about it.

 

[Andy_T]

I fully agree with the article .

I mean, let's be honest, it is quite mean of us to demand that rapists completely stop raping other people. I am sure they would find that quite unpractical and impossible. And, as the article so eloquently states, ...

And we shouldn’t try to determine for others what is possible and practical for them.

There. I think we should be really happy if they try to do their best, e.g. from going to raping one person per week to only raping one per month, and not grievously harming or killing their victims.

Some will point out that veganism (unlike being raw) is about more than diet, which of course it is (though diet covers the biggest part of it). In the sense that veganism is not a diet but a philosophy, an ethos, a way of life, those people might object, it is an all or nothing thing. Either you respect the rights of animals, or you don’t, they may say.

But is it like that, really? Look at our attitude and behavior towards people. Probably none of us, always and everywhere, perfectly respects the rights of all people. Most of us are only kind and compassionate some (hopefully most) of the time. We often slip and fall.

Impeccable logic.

Let's look at our attitude and behaviour towards people and do our best not be mean to people who try to do their best.

 

[robert99]

People do go vegan for health reasons.
Heart Aliments- Result of Genetics, Doping or over exercise? | Cyclingnews Forum
"Is being vegan an all or nothing thing?" The answer lies in the question, being Vegan is "A vegetarian who eats plant products only, especially one who uses no products derived from animals, as fur or leather." vegan Sorry if you don't like it, but that's your problem.

 

[shyvas]

I kind of know how you feel. I'm embarrassed when I have to buy meat and cheese for my roommate. I always make it a point to tell the deli person the meat is not for me as if she cares who it's for.

I wouldn't worry though. If she thought you were a hypocrite, she would probably ask you about it.

That's funny as whilst I was in the UK the person with whom I was staying, made the same point as the check out whilst purchasing vege*n food for me. Furthermore, she told everyone at the barbecue were we were invited about the incident.

 

[Andy_T]

People do go vegan for health reasons.

No, they become plant-based-eaters

 

[Blobbenstein]

No, they become plant-based-eaters

I suppose that means rabbits and sheep aren't vegan...

 

[Danielle]

Herbivores do eat animal products occasionally... Can't really call them vegan.

I kind of know how you feel. I'm embarrassed when I have to buy meat and cheese for my roommate. I always make it a point to tell the deli person the meat is not for me as if she cares who it's for.

I wouldn't worry though. If she thought you were a hypocrite, she would probably ask you about it.

That's awful you have to buy meat and cheese for your room mate. :/ I would flat out refuse.

 

[Blobbenstein]

Herbivores do eat animal products occasionally... Can't really call them vegan.

I mean, since they are probably incapable of choosing to avoid animal products for ethical reasons, they could never be vegans, they could only be plant eaters.....the same goes for most herbivores, as well, I suspect.

 

[Danielle]

maybe they can, you never know. People have a history of under estimating animal intelligence.

 

[Andy_T]

Blob, I fully agree with your logic. Those are herbivores.

I doubt that a cow or sheep could satisfactorily discuss the finer differences between, e.g. Gary Francione and Peter Singer with you.

 

[Calliegirl]

I suppose that means rabbits and sheep aren't vegan...

Until they start wearing leather, I'm going to consider them vegan.

Herbivores do eat animal products occasionally... Can't really call them vegan.

That's awful you have to buy meat and cheese for your room mate. :/ I would flat out refuse.

We have a deal where I do the shopping (she pays for her own things) and she lists a couple of animal products she wants and then I get to choose what to spend the rest of her money on, which is obviously all vegan stuff. It's better than her shopping because she buys a ton of meat and cheese.