Suggestion Conspiracy forum

[beancounter]

It appears that COVID-19 is generating a few conspiracy theories on VF...

So, I suggest a new conspiracy thread (for all conspiracies, not just COVID-19 related)

 

[Nekodaiden]

Uh, no. The "everything covid-19" thread is for everything related to covid-19, not just the ideas that assume it is legitimate. If people dislike opinions that contradict corporate media narratives( to hypnotized consumers of mass media, anything that contradicts it is a "conspiracy theory"), they can ignore posters if they really need a "safe space" from such thinking.

Having a separate forum for opinions differing from the "norm" or the "masses" only limits discussion and encourages group/herd think.

 

[Andy_T]

I would support you ... if it would keep the lunatic fringe conspiracy theories out of the other threads.

Alas ...

 

[beancounter]

Uh, no. The "everything covid-19" thread is for everything related to covid-19,...

That is not for you to decide.

 

[Nekodaiden]

That is not for you to decide.

Having a problem dealing with ideas that don't fit nicely into the media narratives you are hypnotized by? Answer them with truth. Crazy/lunatic/outrageous ideas are best addressed head on, rather than buried.

Btw, the "everything covid-19" thread is a pretty broad description, so it's not up to "my decision", just going by the title. Now if it was the "everything MSM says about covid-19" you might have a point.

You disappoint. My impression of you from a few posts back was that you were an open minded poster. It seems I may be mistaken.

 

[Nekodaiden]

Btw, @beancounter - which part of my recent post constitutes a "conspiracy theory"? Gordon Brown, according to multiple sources, really did call for a world government to deal with coronavirus. You can check that outside of the link I provided. Is this the conspiracy you alluded to? Or was it the fact that Gordan Brown offered a 1.1trillion dollar "rescue package" 11 years ago, and now predicts a 1.1trillion in lost income due to CV?

Which one is not true? Either? Both? Or is this just the kind of information that you can't handle?

 

[Mischief]

This forum is going to have to decide what kind of forum it is.

In normal times, conspiracy theorists can be mildly amusing aberrations; their pretzel-like thinking and the psychology behind it can be somewhat interesting.

But they are not harmless, as we can see from situations such as the current one. From idiots who try to ram trains into hospital ships to those who use every opportunity to spread misinformation such as "viruses do not exist/ do not transmit disease from human to human", they endanger lives.

If I wanted to engage with conspiracy theorists on a daily basis, I would hang out on one of their forums. I don't.

This forum is currently dominated by a conspiracy theorist voice and by one who advocates for survival of the "fittest." What do you think the effect of that is going to be?

I for one am not interested in spending my time like that.

 

[Emma JC]

You already know my thoughts on conspiracy theories, interesting and yet not ultimately helpful for what we have to deal with day to day.

If you wish to post conspiracy theories or theories or facts that you feel most don't know then at the same time you must at least try to post a solution or an action plan that you feel we could partake in that would help us. Yelling that the sky is falling and not providing shelter is not very helpful.

Back on Feb 26 when I tried to carefully raise the alarm that it may be necessary to stock up, I was met with some resistance and yet I provided suggestions and lists and links to why I was raising the alarm.

You @Nekodaiden and others must do the same - most people are just trying to get through the day and source food and other necessities and keep themselves and their loved ones safe. Do something to raise our spirits, please.

Emma JC

 

[Nekodaiden]

This forum is going to have to decide what kind of forum it is.

In normal times, conspiracy theorists can be mildly amusing aberrations; their pretzel-like thinking and the psychology behind it can be somewhat interesting.

But they are not harmless, as we can see from situations such as the current one. From idiots who try to ram trains into hospital ships to those who use every opportunity to spread misinformation such as "viruses do not exist/ do not transmit disease from human to human", they endanger lives.

If I wanted to engage with conspiracy theorists on a daily basis, I would hang out on one of their forums. I don't.

This forum is currently dominated by a conspiracy theorist voice and by one who advocates for survival of the "fittest." What do you think the effect of that is going to be?

I for one am not interested in spending my time like that.

You challenged me on the Stefan Lanke court case with your wikipedia article and you were shot down with the truth of what the court rulings really said.

I do not "dominate" this forum, nor do I advocate for survival of the fittest. If you don't like my posts, ignore me. Wouldn't that be the best way of not wasting your time?

 

[beancounter]

Having a problem dealing with ideas that don't fit nicely into the media narratives you are hypnotized by? Answer them with truth. Crazy/lunatic/outrageous ideas are best addressed head on, rather than buried.

Btw, the "everything covid-19" thread is a pretty broad description, so it's not up to "my decision", just going by the title. Now if it was the "everything MSM says about covid-19" you might have a point.

You disappoint. My impression of you from a few posts back was that you were an open minded poster. It seems I may be mistaken.

Nice passive-aggressive ad hominem attack....

It will pass under the Mod's radar of course, but your intent is obvious.

 

[beancounter]

So Mods, any decision on this suggestion?

 

[shyvas]

So Mods, any decision on this suggestion?

Not yet as we have a backlog of work....

 

[silva]

It's all pretzel logic, no good comes in debate.
I find myself reading so many posts in the voice of my friend who does sarcasm very well, and laughing. Rather than getting sucked into responding, I leave it at that.

Y2K, 911 conspirists, the moon landing, and Sandy Hook deniers, Flat earthers.....so much stupid
We all are aware of how much information gets twisted by governments, and religions, and our employers-anyone over us, but that doesn't mean we have to join the crazy cult.

 

[beforewisdom]

It appears that COVID-19 is generating a few conspiracy theories on VF...

So, I suggest a new conspiracy thread (for all conspiracies, not just COVID-19 related)

I disagree with this idea.

Conspiracy theories don't do anything positive. They encourage an unhealthy type of thinking. They encourage misinformation and fear.

I think the best thing to do for conspiracies theories is to remove them completely.

 

[beancounter]

I disagree with this idea.

Conspiracy theories don't do anything positive. They encourage an unhealthy type of thinking. They encourage misinformation and fear.

I think the best thing to do for conspiracies theories is to remove them completely.

While I agree with you in general, I also believe that everyone should be able to voice their opinion. (with the exception of advocating violence against others).

And to avoid CT from clogging up other threads, I think it would be a good idea to have a dedicated thread where we can isolate (but not silence) those "off the deep end" views.

Think of it as a "smoking section". You don't stop people from smoking, but if they chose to do so, they have to engage in that behavior separately from others.

 

[Nekodaiden]

To establish a "conspiracy forum" means setting up moderation staff as
ultimate arbiteres what is considered a conspiracy, and what is "mainstream"
or popular opinion/belief.

May I remind everyone that most of the world eats animal products, thinks
of them as necessary/healthy and to them vegans are in a minority position
who believes differently. That is the mainstream. The herd - and to be a vegan
means you stand outside it, at least in this respect.

To be a "conspiracy theorist" generally means (to most who use the term) that
such a person disbelieves certain things government(s) promote/teach or non-acceptance
of ideas that are common/widespread in society.

As a vegan, a "conspiracy theorist" by the above understanding is already one. We
stand against the common practice of consuming animals, and also against government
policy that subsidizes or promotes it, and against propaganda that promotes it.


Instead of staff bowing to the pressure of certain individuals to enable thought
control outside the theme of this forum on topics they are not comfortable challenging,
I would suggest staff looking at the individuals themselves to see who is really
trying to "rule" this forum either by petitions like this, unnecessary post reporting
or through the private message system.

I can say publicly I have done none of these things in an effort to either control
thought or in an attempt to get posters censured/removed.

 

[beforewisdom]

While I agree with you in general, I also believe that everyone should be able to voice their opinion. (with the exception of advocating violence against others).

I don't

There is the example of free speech ending with the shouting of "fire" in a crowded theater.

Deleting conspiracy theories and misinformation will unclog what is clogged, and everyone will be better off not have dangerously wrong information or insinuations out there to spread.

A global crisis is happening. Misinformation and conspiracy theories has, and can get more people hurt.

 

[beancounter]

I don't

There is the example of free speech ending with the shouting of "fire" in a crowded theater.

Deleting conspiracy theories and misinformation will unclog what is clogged, and everyone will be better off not have dangerously wrong information or insinuations out there to spread.

A global crisis is happening. Misinformation and conspiracy theories has, and can get more people hurt.

Well if a post is in (or was moved) to the CT thread, people will know to view it with an abundance of skepticism.

 

[Lou]

As a vegan, a "conspiracy theorist" by the above understanding is already one. We
stand against the common practice of consuming animals, and also against government
policy that subsidizes or promotes it, and against propaganda that promotes it.

the idea that our health and our environment's health is improved by eating less meat is widely accepted now. No longer a minority viewpoint.

we ethically motivated vegans never needed anyone telling us that livestock is mistreated. you just needed to drive by a stockyard or a dairy. The thing that started me on my vegan journey was an article I read in the local paper about the conditions of cows on a local dairy farm. So I give credit to mainstream media for that.

anyone who can think for themselves can be skeptical of marketing and advertising. No theories are necessary for that.

the skyrocketing sales of plant-based food also show how acceptable and mainstream we are.

 

[silva]

Why is there no disagree in the response catagory?
There is no way to debate these people as they continually deflect and change their story.

"twisted or circular reasoning that when dissected is wrong, does not make sense or does not explain the situation rationally."