BBC-"vegan junk food & health"

ewomack

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BBC article: "Why vegan junk food may be even worse for your health"

This article may have already been discussed here, but in Sept 2020, the BBC posted the article "Why vegan junk food may be even worse for your health." Their inclusion of the word "junk" may say it all, but I'm curious what people here think about the article's claims, such as that eating meat alternatives can make one nutritionally deficient and that it may take some time to notice the deficiency. I'm guessing that they're possibly focusing on the worst meat alternatives that exist purely for marketing or financial reasons and they also use the term "vegan fast food," which seems difficult to define. But it does say that items like tofu, jack fruit and even beans don't deliver the health benefits often claimed. The suggestion of the article overall seems to be that vegan meat alternatives "might" be worse for your health than meat itself, with some conditions I'm skeptical about the article overall, but was curious what others think.
 
I didn't read the article. Just skimmed it. If I had the time and inclination I would go thru it point by point and rip it up.

The first thing he brings up is Omega 3. Again I didn't read it - but since Omega 3 is not well studied or understood this is not something that should be first on the list. Although Carnists may get adequate Omega 3s in their diet (a debatable fact), what is the cost. If they eat enough fish to get enough Omega 3 they are also injecting an unhealthy amount of heavy metals.

The next paragraph gets into amino acids. OHMYGOSh. This is the most tired argument. The author of Diet for a Small Planet, who probably started this myth, recanted 50 years ago.

I'm not even skim any more. If that is the authors top two points the rest must be total garbage.

A lot of these health articles are just playing to an audience. Also I wonder about the authors credentials. A lot of these reporters are not un-biased.

On a more general note, plant based alternative are probably never worse health-wise than their animal based original. And even more importantly - they are probably never worse for the environment. And they are Never worse for the animals.
 
Really did an eye roll at this:
“Tofu contains omega 3 but it is a type that is not as active as animal sources,” says Rossi. Plant-based sources contain a type of omega 3 called alpha-linolenic acid (ALA). For our bodies to be able to do anything particularly useful with ALA, we need to convert it into eicosapentaenoic acid (EPA) or docosahexaenoic acid (DHA). However, humans are not particularly well equipped to do this.
Only food from the sea contains EPA/DHA--which includes fish, as well as seaweeds and algae, where fish get it from!

I am jealous at the UK vegan variety!

Pretty common to have comparisons of vegan foods being junk to animal based that are clean.
 
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I've tried a lot of different supplements in my time. A number of them pricey.

I have never felt as noticeably better than when I used cronometer.com for a few weeks to make sure that I got 100% of my required nutrients every day.

People always think they eat better than they actually do. That goes for me too.

Micronutritents are a thing.

What you put in your mouth really does make a difference in how you feel.
 
BBC article: "Why vegan junk food may be even worse for your health"

This article may have already been discussed here, but in Sept 2020, the BBC posted the article "Why vegan junk food may be even worse for your health." Their inclusion of the word "junk" may say it all, but I'm curious what people here think about the article's claims, such as that eating meat alternatives can make one nutritionally deficient and that it may take some time to notice the deficiency. I'm guessing that they're possibly focusing on the worst meat alternatives that exist purely for marketing or financial reasons and they also use the term "vegan fast food," which seems difficult to define. But it does say that items like tofu, jack fruit and even beans don't deliver the health benefits often claimed. The suggestion of the article overall seems to be that vegan meat alternatives "might" be worse for your health than meat itself, with some conditions I'm skeptical about the article overall, but was curious what others think.

A better point would be that any manufactured foods will be on a spectrum of terrible, no matter how large the font says "NOW WITH MORE HEALTHY STUFF" on the label. Are vegan deep-fried Oreos in an impossible-meat sandwich worse than stewed kangaroo from a pure risk comparison? Seems plausible. Was eating like a vegan more healthy 100 years ago when the industries didn't market to them much? Absolutely. The best comparison I've learned so far with some of this manufactured food is that it's like methadone for a heroin addict -- useful to wean the hopelessly-addicted meat eater into a slightly better habit. The end habit is ideally minimally processed plants.
 
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There was a time when everyone ate nothing but real foods. General stores came about for people who grew and milled food to sell there goods to others. This led to more affluent business people to realize money can be made easily by taking foods at little cost and making them more desirable at high profits. Fruits and veg became sugars and sugars became highly processed. No one 'wanted' hydrogenated trans fats, or foods with so much sodium they create heart disease, diabetes and morbid obesity, yet, here they are
When low fat was the fad they replaced oils with slimey starches. Calorie free sodas got nasty chemical sweeteners instead. Did people want slimey salad dressings or nasty sweet soda? They're buying them now.
If vegans are really after ethics why would align themselves with the meat industry to dissuade people from buying the types of food they want to buy? produce and beans and grains have been around forever, yet they haven't caused people to give up meats, and even less than give up meat, they don't want to give up the processed foods than contain animals and their products. Everywhere they turn. They want fast food, they want microwave lunches and dinners. they want them at affordable prices
So why are vegans joining the meat and dairy to stop people from buying the very alternatives that have shown to change direction from animal eating norms to plant based options?
Seems you're cutting off your nose to spite your face
 
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There was a time when everyone ate nothing but real foods. General stores came about for people who grew and milled food to sell there goods to others. This led to more affluent business people to realize money can be made easily by taking foods at little cost and making them more desirable at high profits. Fruits and veg became sugars and sugars became highly processed. No one 'wanted' hydrogenated trans fats, or foods with so much sodium they create heart disease, diabetes and morbid obesity, yet, here they are
When low fat was the fad they replaced oils with slimey starches. Calorie free sodas got nasty chemical sweeteners instead. Did people want slimey salad dressings or nasty sweet soda? They're buying them now.
If vegans are really after ethics why would align themselves with the meat industry to dissuade people from buying the types of food they want to buy? produce and beans and grains have been around forever, yet they haven't caused people to give up meats, and even less than give up meat, they don't want to give up the processed foods than contain animals and their products. Everywhere they turn. They want fast food, they want microwave lunches and dinners. they want them at affordable prices
So why are vegans joining the meat and dairy to stop people from buying the very alternatives that have shown to change direction from animal eating norms to plant based options?
Seems you're cutting off your nose to spite your face
It's in our survival programming to seek shortcuts. To be fair to the vast majority I've seen among vegans, it's not their fault that we're wired to conserve energy. We will naturally gravitate to convenience in all the exponential ways available. And as long as all the business incentive is with showing shareholder value every quarter, we will continue getting our environments defined in ways that harm us. And we're always going to be slaves to what's in front of us until we collectively give up our survival instinct to be certain about everything we think we know.
 
It's in our survival programming to seek shortcuts. To be fair to the vast majority I've seen among vegans, it's not their fault that we're wired to conserve energy. We will naturally gravitate to convenience in all the exponential ways available. And as long as all the business incentive is with showing shareholder value every quarter, we will continue getting our environments defined in ways that harm us. And we're always going to be slaves to what's in front of us until we collectively give up our survival instinct to be certain about everything we think we know.
All I was trying to say was how sick I am of vegans being criticised for wanting the same kinds of foods they chose as omnivores.
Anyone who is vegan for animals would care less about individual choices if it creates less impact on animals. I hear too much from certain individuals here as well.
Vegan says nothing but avoiding use of animals, If you want to eat wfpb that's an individual choice and doesnt' make you any better than those who make fried seitan like KFC
 
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All I was trying to say was how sick I am of vegans being criticised for wanting the same kinds of foods they chose as omnivores.
Anyone who is vegan for animals would care less about individual choices if it creates less impact on animals. I hear too much from certain individuals here as well.
Vegan says nothing but avoiding use of animals, If you want to eat wfpb that's an individual choice and doesnt' make you any better than those who make fried seitan like KFC
Why does this have to be a right and wrong competition? Nobody's attacking you or your identity.
 
All I was trying to say was how sick I am of vegans being criticised for wanting the same kinds of foods they chose as omnivores.
Anyone who is vegan for animals would care less about individual choices if it creates less impact on animals. I hear too much from certain individuals here as well.
Vegan says nothing but avoiding use of animals, If you want to eat wfpb that's an individual choice and doesnt' make you any better than those who make fried seitan like KFC
Full quote because I completely agree. Not every vegan wants to eat WFPB and it doesn't make you "a better vegan" if you don't crave the same foods you ate as an omnivore.

Why so judgmental? When did this start?
 
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Why does this have to be a right and wrong competition? Nobody's attacking you or your identity.
Beg your pardon but this

The best comparison I've learned so far with some of this manufactured food is that it's like methadone for a heroin addict -- useful to wean the hopelessly-addicted meat eater into a slightly better habit. The end habit is ideally minimally processed plants.
sounds as judgmental and arrogant as it can be.
 
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Full quote because I completely agree. Not every vegan wants to eat WFPB and it doesn't make you "a better vegan" if you don't crave the same foods you ate as an omnivore.

Why so judgmental? When did this start?
Fact is that people can still choose to eat like this - vegan or not. However, many people choose not to do this for various reasons.
What I've come across on US forums, and real life, is the a very distinct divide between those eating plant based for their health, and those for their ethics.
Physicians who advocate wfpb diets have been wise to label them as plant based rather than vegan, regardless of their personal stance, yet followers have too often hijacked the "vegan diet" label. Many have no desire whatsoever to follow anything vegan besides the omission of animal products in foods.
Vegan "diet" says nothing at all about food choice besides the omission of animal products. Plant based peeps will get very defensive when this is pointed out as why it's wrong for them to use the term "vegan diet" when theirs is both so specific for choices and reasons. They'll call vegans as being like a "club" with so many requirements. 🙄, and ask why we care so much about labels-which is funny with them being the ones wanting to use a label they don't fall under :im: . Many people who say they eat a wfpb "vegan diet" don't even adhere to no animal products, but instead feel the small amounts aren't affecting their health so it's fine

I've found that the vast majority of people don't "want" to eat animals but want to eat what they're accustomed to, at the same convenience and price. So many have watched documentaries and still want Popeyes chicken and steakhouse steaks. For them the foods like Impossible and Beyond burgers and sausages fill a need that bean burgers never will\

I'm so appalled at every single post about a vegan celebrities food choices being trashed. Or reviews of vegan cookbooks torn apart for including the same foods omnis eat every day missing the animal parts. Omnivores know if they see a cookbook that isn't listed as health promoting is going to include all kinds of processed foods yet vegans are targeted

I wish vegan 'diet' would be kept defined as no animal products and left it at that
 
I just thought this is much like the whole business of fat shaming. While so many follow health decisions that are detrimental to their health if they look at the proper weight they never get shamed for it, while those who obviously have too many pounds on their bodies are immediately deemed to be making bad intentional decisions even if they follow better diets and exercise than their slimmer counterparts

We need to call out the apples to carrots comparisons of vegan/omni diets
 
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I wish vegan 'diet' would be kept defined as no animal products and left it at that
So much this.

This kind of "nutritional judgement" is so damn unnecessary. Same with omnivore "clean eaters" bashing other omnivores because they eat "junk food".

Ah well, can't discuss religion, politics or diet. LOL
 
We need to call out the apples to carrots comparisons of vegan/omni diets
Nah, I think the vegan and the omnivore diet have finally something in common: there are the "clean eaters" and the "junk food eaters". ;)

I never noticed much of "WFPB vs. junk food vegans" until some years ago and wonder when and why that discussion started.
 
Nah, I think the vegan and the omnivore diet have finally something in common: there are the "clean eaters" and the "junk food eaters". ;)

I never noticed much of "WFPB vs. junk food vegans" until some years ago and wonder when and why that discussion started.
Oh that's what i meant. You all too often have junk food vegan diets compared to all grass fed organic omni diets. When you compare junk food vegans and junk food omnis they're both only as bad as their choices. When you compare wfpb with the Whole 30 omni version I'm quite sure wfpb comes on top--and much cheaper!
How many people have argued with me the value of pastuere raised animals, while at the same time complaining how expensive organic produce is, while never buying either one 🙄

Just like insects and offal are no longer common in omnivore diets, I want to see animals no longer common in omnivore diets!
 
Oh that's what i meant. You all too often have junk food vegan diets compared to all grass fed organic omni diets.
Ah, I see what you mean and I share that opinion. I wasn't sure what you mean before.

It's like when people compare the most expensive possible vegan diet with all organic foods and vegan substitutes with the cheapest possible omnivore diet when it comes to the question "Is a vegan diet expensive?".

A vegan diet is as healthy and as expensive as people make it - just as most other diets.
 
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Could someone enlightenmen me as to what "WFPB" is?
Whole Food Plant Based
WFPB is a specific healthy vegan diet, being only fruits veg beans seeds nuts---nothing processed beyond cooking
Saying wfpb doesn't imply you're vegan, just as vegan doesn't imply wfpb
 
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