Are humans designed to eat meat?

[Second Summer]

Clearly humans can eat meat, and have been eating meat for thousands and thousands of years, and have been thriving quite well on that diet. Archeological evidence suggests it wasn't until the later stone age and iron age that caries became a problem, perhaps due to eating more carbohydrate rich and processed foods. The people in the early stone age had bigger bones as well. (Of course, they also got a lot more exercise back in those days. Okay, and on average only lived until they got to be around 25-40 years, but that was likely due to all the fighting with sabre tooth tigers, wolves, bears, and dinosaurs.)

Also, God (the Christian one, the others are obviously fake) said that we could eat meat after The Flood. And God rejectred Cain's vegetable sacrifice, but praised Abel's lamb sacrifice. Also, God-fearing good old boys such as the benevolent General Franco of Spain strongly discouraged vegetarianism and denied vegetarian restaurants to do business.

Also, meat has the essential B12 vitamin which is not found naturally in plant foods. And fish has long chained omega 3s and vitamin D. So it would seem eating meat is natural, especially the paleo diet.

Also, animals kill and eat each other, so how can it be wrong for humans, who are animals, to kill and eat other animals? Isn't that only natural?

So what is the vegetarian response to this?

(Disclaimer: These opinions are not my own; I'm just trying to encourage discussion of a topic that may be of interest to many new vegetarians and the vegetarian-curious!)

 

[CrazyCatLady]

I am also interested in seeing other people's responses to this.
I'm constantly faces with omni statements regarding us having canine teeth and being 'designed to eat meat' xxx

 

[Lord Snot]

We're not designed for anything. Have we ADAPTED to eating meat? Yes, I think the evidence is clear and I find it a bit embarrassing when vegetarians claim we haven't. We can digest meat, although not as quickly as vegetable matter, and we can certainly get good levels of nutrition from it. We can be healthy on an omnivorous diet. I think I have probably said the opposite in my earlier days as a veggie because a) I wanted to believe it and b) I was convinced by other veggies arguing it. But once I actually looked into it myself instead of just believing what I wanted to be true, I was completely unconvinced.

I also find it painful when people claim we should be raw vegans because that's what our closest ape ancestors are. It's cringey and nonsensical and I think they're deluded.

These kinds of questions I find of little importance. I don't care what humans did 33,000 years ago, I don't care what chimps do, I don't care if it takes 2 hours to digest a banana and 36 hours to digest a steak. Does it matter? Not at all. The facts are clear; we can be perfectly healthy on a veggie diet, we can be perfectly healthy on a omnivorous diet. So since both are good, viable options, other factors have to come in to help us decide which one is the RIGHT diet. For me that will always be the fact that an omnivorous diet requires other sentient beings to die, ones who don't want to die, and a vegan diet does not. I'm not going to get into it because I know we have some lacto-ovo vegetarians here, but there are similar reasons why I think that diet is the wrong choice too.

Can anyone actually explain why it matters what we ate when we lived in caves?

 

[beancounter]

The short answer is yes. But that doesn't mean we should.....

 

[Lord Snot]

I forgot the obligatory correction that the Flintstones was not actual footage and that humans never battled dinosaurs

 

[Blobbenstein]

You've spoiled my fantasy of asking out Betty Rubble, if she ever leaves Barney...

 

[Digger]

You've spoiled my fantasy of asking out Betty Rubble, if she ever leaves Barney...

She was quite the looker, eh?

 

[Digger]

The word 'designed' seems to present problems for many folks but I simply take the word to mean 'evolved' or 'adapted' and go from there.

 

[ledboots]

She was quite the looker, eh?

My husband says it is her giggle.

 

[FortyTwo]

We're not designed for anything. Have we ADAPTED to eating meat? Yes, I think the evidence is clear and I find it a bit embarrassing when vegetarians claim we haven't.

THIS.

Whether I agree with the sentiment or not it gets so annoying when people claim things that are inaccurate about vegetarianism. It's like, I want to agree with you really bad, but please, do your research...

 

[Freesia]

My opinion is that humans are opportunists, similar to other species which have thrived and lived nearly everywhere, like cockroaches or rats. We can eat a wide range of things. Some humans moved to places where there were a lot of animals and birds and other humans moved to places where plants turned out to be the dominant food source, such as lentils in places like Pakistan and india, or millet in Africa, wheat in Europe, corn in South America, or rice in Asia.

Further evidence of this is seen in the chimpanzee's diet. Chimpanzees in the wild tend to eat a lot of vegetation and fruit, and also eat a lot of termites and other insects. Sometimes they will hunt smaller animals if they have the inclination, and sometimes they wont. They are fine either way.

 

[Wolfie]

Humans aren't designed to eat meat. Of course we've adapted and can be completely healthy eating small amounts of it but when I think of being "designed" to eat meat I think of a cat or a shark or a dog.

 

[Digger]

Humans aren't designed to eat meat.

If only for the sake of controversy I have to respectfully disagree. It's true that we don't have the digestive tract of a true carnivore, but it's equally true that we don't have the digestive tract of a true herbivore either. We are well-adapted for both.

 

[Calliegirl]

Someone posted this on FB. I haven't checked it out to see if all the points they made are true or not. I put it in spoiler tags because it's really long.

Spoiler

Anatomically and physiologically, people are herbivores.

Facial Muscles
Carnivore: Reduced to allow wide mouth gape
Herbivore: Well-developed
Omnivore: Reduced
Human: Well-developed

Jaw Type
Carnivore: Angle not expanded
Herbivore: Expanded angle
Omnivore: Angle not expanded
Human: Expanded angle

Jaw Joint Location
Carnivore: On same plane as molar teeth
Herbivore: Above the plane of the molars
Omnivore: On same plane as molar teeth
Human: Above the plane of the molars

Jaw Motion
Carnivore: Shearing; minimal side-to-side motion
Herbivore: No shear; good side-to-side, front-to-back
Omnivore: Shearing; minimal side-to-side
Human: No shear; good side-to-side, front-to-back

Major Jaw Muscles
Carnivore: Temporalis
Herbivore: Masseter and pterygoids
Omnivore: Temporalis
Human: Masseter and pterygoids

Mouth Opening vs. Head Size
Carnivore: Large
Herbivore: Small
Omnivore: Large
Human: Small

Teeth (Incisors)
Carnivore: Short and pointed
Herbivore: Broad, flattened and spade shaped
Omnivore: Short and pointed
Human: Broad, flattened and spade shaped

Teeth (Canines)
Carnivore: Long, sharp and curved
Herbivore: Dull and short or long (for defense), or none
Omnivore: Long, sharp and curved
Human: Short and blunted

Teeth (Molars)
Carnivore: Sharp, jagged and blade shaped
Herbivore: Flattened with cusps vs complex surface
Omnivore: Sharp blades and/or flattened
Human: Flattened with nodular cusps

Chewing
Carnivore: None; swallows food whole
Herbivore: Extensive chewing necessary
Omnivore: Swallows food whole and/or simple crushing
Human: Extensive chewing necessary

Saliva
Carnivore: No digestive enzymes
Herbivore: Carbohydrate digesting enzymes
Omnivore: No digestive enzymes
Human: Carbohydrate digesting enzymes

Stomach
Carnivore: Simple
Herbivore: Simple or multiple chambers
Omnivore: Simple
Human: Simple

Stomach Acidity
Carnivore: Less than or equal to pH 1 with food in stomach
Herbivore: pH 4 to 5 with food in stomach
Omnivore: Less than or equal to pH 1 with food in stomach
Human: pH 4 to 5 with food in stomach

Stomach Capacity
Carnivore: 60% to 70% of total volume of digestive tract
Herbivore: Less than 30% of total volume of digestive tract
Omnivore: 60% to 70% of total volume of digestive tract
Human: 21% to 27% of total volume of digestive tract

Length of Small Intestine
Carnivore: 3 to 6 times body length
Herbivore: 10 to more than 12 times body length
Omnivore: 4 to 6 times body length
Human: 10 to 11 times body length

Colon
Carnivore: Simple, short and smooth
Herbivore: Long, complex; may be sacculated
Omnivore: Simple, short and smooth
Human: Long, sacculated

Liver
Carnivore: Can detoxify vitamin A
Herbivore: Cannot detoxify vitamin A
Omnivore: Can detoxify vitamin A
Human: Cannot detoxify vitamin A

Kidneys
Carnivore: Extremely concentrated urine
Herbivore: Moderately concentrated urine
Omnivore: Extremely concentrated urine
Human: Moderately concentrated urine

Nails
Carnivore: Sharp claws
Herbivore: Flattened nails or blunt hooves
Omnivore: Sharp claws
Human: Flattened nails

 

[AeryFairy]

I'm gonna go ahead and replace the word 'designed' with 'evolved'.

IMO (and what I've taken from my mediocre grasp of science), we have evolved to survive. We humans can survive (and thrive) on meat, on vegetation, or on both. The point, to me, is that we do not need meat to survive. We may have needed it at some point, and we may need it again (either as a collective group or as individuals). But right now, with my cosy little lifestyle where all of my food is readily available, I don't need meat. I am perfectly capable of thriving on vegetable matter alone, and I do so for a variety of reasons.

 

[Mr Crunchy]

Also, animals kill and eat each other, so how can it be wrong for humans, who are animals, to kill and eat other animals? Isn't that only natural?

"Nature is cruel, but we don't have to be" - Temple Grandin

 

[peacefulveglady]

I am going with this, I believe that we evolved and its your own decision what is right for your body and system each person is different. I also don't like that you have to have organized religion or worry about a lifestyle or helping poor animals and stuff.

I'm gonna go ahead and replace the word 'designed' with 'evolved'.

IMO (and what I've taken from my mediocre grasp of science), we have evolved to survive. We humans can survive (and thrive) on meat, on vegetation, or on both. The point, to me, is that we do not need meat to survive. We may have needed it at some point, and we may need it again (either as a collective group or as individuals). But right now, with my cosy little lifestyle where all of my food is readily available, I don't need meat. I am perfectly capable of thriving on vegetable matter alone, and I do so for a variety of reasons.

 

[Blobbenstein]

"Nature is cruel, but we don't have to be" - Temple Grandin

But isn't she just in favour of creepy 'humane' slaughter houses?

This quote from The Restaurant at the End of the Universe seems apt, and I can imagine Temple Grandin doing it:

After a while an animal- a deer perhaps – would appear from out of the trees and watch him cautiously. Ford would continue to smile at it, his eyes would soften and shine, and he would seem to radiate a deep and universal love, a love which reached out to embrace all of creation. A wonderful quietness would descend on the surrounding countryside, peaceful and serene, emanating from this transfigured man. Slowly the dear would approach, step by step, until it was almost nuzzling him, whereupon Ford Prefect would reach out to it and break it’s neck.

• The Restaurant at the End of the Universe

Always seemed disgusting to me; no criticism of Douglas Adams though.

 

[FortyTwo]

But isn't she just in favour of creepy 'humane' slaughter houses?

This quote from The Restaurant at the End of the Universe seems apt, and I can imagine Temple Grandin doing it:



Always seemed disgusting to me; no criticism of Douglas Adams though.

The Guide books are filled with dark humor, though, so that never bugged me.

 

[Mr Crunchy]

But isn't she just in favour of creepy 'humane' slaughter houses?

Yes, nevertheless the quote accurately represents my opinion on the matter and I don't want to plagiarize.