A house divided

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A columnist at The Washington Post is asking readers whose families are politically divided to share their stories. This is one response, which (especially the part I've bolded) happens to reflect my own views/attitudes:

My grandparents and some uncles lean Republican (the uncles are changing, though) whereas my entire immediate family, husband and in-laws are all straight-up very liberal Democrats.

The problem is not really who you vote for - that's so much window dressing. It's the social values that are behind your choice that are the problem. I love my grandparents & uncles, but I can't respect someone who would vote for a guy who wants to restrict gay rights and women's rights, whose ideals come from a belief in a god that I do not share (I'm an atheist and believe in secular government, I don't want laws that affect me to be based on someone else's religion), and who is a part of a party that hates gays and doesn't understand the concept of female social and bodily autonomy. Even if you don't believe those things, if you vote for the guys who do because of "the economy", you are complicit in their hate.

So I am in the position of loving, but not respecting, that side of my family. It is hard to love someone you don't respect.

Our own household is unlikely to be divided: if it were just about economic and foreign policy I could happily agree to disagree with someone. When it's about my own rights, when it's about bigotry, homophobia, systematic suppression of the lower classes and straight-up sexist BS, I simply cannot. Nothing kills my lady-boner faster than a man who wants to take away my rights, and I could not stay in a relationship with one, or one who would vote those guys in anyway and allow my rights to be taken away.

If my husband took a hard turn to the right on social values (not likely! he respects women and believes in marriage equality!) I would - honestly - probably divorce him. Not over politics but over irreconcilable values.


What are your thoughts?
 
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That sounds accurate.

I was arguing UK politics in the pub last night, with a guy who I can get along with just fine if we don't touch political issues. I said pretty much the same thing to him; he was arguing that the conservatives should stay in power, but every single fact was entirely based on money (helpfully ignoring the MASSIVE CUTS that have made life incredibly grim for most people). The economics is all fairly similar at this point. What I don't want is a giant step backwards; a racist, homophobic, sexist, classist government doesn't work for me.

Luckily, my nearest and dearest feel the same way.
 
Every person that I know is left-wing. I really am very intolerant when it comes to dealing with people with very different values to my own. :p (The exception is veganism as I would love to only surround myself with vegans but it isn't terribly realistic considering how small a number we are.)
 
Our own household is unlikely to be divided: if it were just about economic and foreign policy


What are your thoughts?

TO me it is just as bothersome if someone ignores the economic and foreign policy thing as womens rights, gay rights etc. I dont understand those who like wars and dont believe in people having access to homes and healthcare and education. I find that as hard to ignore as if someone was anti gay or anti woman.
 
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I think it has to do with priorities.

Just because you vote republican, doesn't mean that you want to go the Grinch on people rights, but maybe only that other things that they have is more important, and that those things cannot be found in the Democrats.
 
I think it has to do with priorities.

Just because you vote republican, doesn't mean that you want to go the Grinch on people rights, but maybe only that other things that they have is more important, and that those things cannot be found in the Democrats.
This is very true. I know lots of Republicans, lots of Democrats, lots of Independents, lots that don't vote at all. If I restricted my friends and family to those that had my exact views on everything, my life would be way more lonely and boring.
 
This is very true. I know lots of Republicans, lots of Democrats, lots of Independents, lots that don't vote at all. If I restricted my friends and family to those that had my exact views on everything, my life would be way more lonely and boring.

You're never going to find someone with your exact views on everything and I don't think that's what this thread is about. There are some things I can accept in a person without losing respect for them, for example a fair number of my friends and family want the death penalty back, and there are some that I can't, like someone who wanted to take away my reproductive choices or someone who thought homosexuality should still be illegal. I couldn't be friends with, live with or respect people with those views.
 
You're never going to find someone with your exact views on everything and I don't think that's what this thread is about. There are some things I can accept in a person without losing respect for them, for example a fair number of my friends and family want the death penalty back, and there are some that I can't, like someone who wanted to take away my reproductive choices or someone who thought homosexuality should still be illegal. I couldn't be friends with, live with or respect people with those views.
How about gun control, immigration policy, everlasting war and drone attacks on the terrorists / Islam (same thing in some people's minds), privatization of everything, deregulation of the finance industry ... To what extent could you be friends with, live with or respect people who hold opposite views on those issues?
 
You're never going to find someone with your exact views on everything and I don't think that's what this thread is about. There are some things I can accept in a person without losing respect for them, for example a fair number of my friends and family want the death penalty back, and there are some that I can't, like someone who wanted to take away my reproductive choices or someone who thought homosexuality should still be illegal. I couldn't be friends with, live with or respect people with those views.
I see, and of course my close friends are bound to have views close to my own on the things really important to me, too. As far as family goes, I learned a long time ago not to get into political discussions of any kind with my parents or siblings. My husband and children have views pretty similar to my own on most things; in fact we all voted/are voting quite similarly in most of the races this election.
 
How about gun control, immigration policy, everlasting war and drone attacks on the terrorists / Islam (same thing in some people's minds), privatization of everything, deregulation of the finance industry ... To what extent could you be friends with, live with or respect people who hold opposite views on those issues?

Are you making a point? It seems a bit weird to single me out and ask for my views on those issues :S
 
Are you making a point? It seems a bit weird to single me out and ask for my views on those issues :S
Yes, it's an attempt at a rhetorical question. (And wasn't really asking for your views on those issues, although that would be interesting as well! :)) You mentioned two issues where you consider it to be crucial that you and potential friends are compatible. I'm just saying that there are other important issues, and when you think about it (at least that's how I see it), some of those can be as important in your relationship with others. Women and gay rights are not everything! Perhaps I'm just more sensitive to this than many others here since those two issue are not at the very top of my own list of important issues.
 
Yes, it's an attempt at a rhetorical question. (And wasn't really asking for your views on those issues, although that would be interesting as well! :)) You mentioned two issues where you consider it to be crucial that you and potential friends are compatible. I'm just saying that there are other important issues, and when you think about it (at least that's how I see it), some of those can be as important in your relationship with others. Women and gay rights are not everything! Perhaps I'm just more sensitive to this than many others here since those two issue are not at the very top of my own list of important issues.

Yes, definitely too sensitive. I was giving examples, since it would have been impractical to give a full list of the things I will and will not choose to accept in my friends.
 
I see, and of course my close friends are bound to have views close to my own on the things really important to me, too. As far as family goes, I learned a long time ago not to get into political discussions of any kind with my parents or siblings. My husband and children have views pretty similar to my own on most things; in fact we all voted/are voting quite similarly in most of the races this election.
What's in bold is my situation as well. I'm the resident "tree-hugging liberal," according to my family, most of whom lean to the right. This also goes for my friends; we just don't talk politics if we're on opposite sides of the fence.
 
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I used to want the death penalty when I was young. There was a lot of violent crime in my area when I was at high school, my school district had its own brutal serial rapist who attacked women living near my school and at a large sports park across the road from the school. It went on for a few years and he was finally caught and faced 120 sex charges.

Also my cousin was nearly stabbed to death at work when she was 17 by her ex. I was pretty sick of it all by then, I would have happily pulled the switch on either of these men.

Perhaps that should go in Unpopular Opinions though. I am not a proponent for the death penalty anymore but I do believe in longer sentences for violent crimes. The men here who commit violent crimes get pretty much a slap on the wrist.
 
Perhaps that should go in Unpopular Opinions though. I am not a proponent for the death penalty anymore but I do believe in longer sentences for violent crimes. The men here who commit violent crimes get pretty much a slap on the wrist.

I agree with you. I think the sentences in the UK are far too lenient on violent/sexual crimes. I would want prisoners to have rehabilitation in there and hopefully behavioural therapy and no ill treatment but I think there should be a long sentence as a punishment for certain violent crimes.
 
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Women and gay rights are not everything! Perhaps I'm just more sensitive to this than many others here since those two issue are not at the very top of my own list of important issues.

Women and gay rights are very important to me as I'm a woman from the LGBTQ community. It doesn't mean other issues aren't important too as I do sign petitions and send letters on other matters but I don't tend to mention them on a veg forum.
 
Women's and LGBTQ issues are a top priority for me. I could not be married to someone who wanted women's rights to be reduced, or who did not believe in marriage equality, etc. I could also not be married to someone who thought one set of religious beliefs should be more important than someone else's.

I do have differing views with Husband on things like gun control. (I'm not happy that there are guns in the house, he's planning his next gun purchase.) I'm not entirely sure where he stands on the death penalty. (We did have a lively discussion about that once, and while I feel like he came around to my point of view by the end of it, idk if he just wanted to stop talking about it. :p )

I don't have any close real life friends who have radically different views than I do.

As far as family, both my own family and my husband's will talk for hours, basically towing the Democratic line, then declare that they could never vote for anyone who was not a Republican. I think that might infuriate me more than someone who has an opposing viewpoint than I do, but who votes their values. So I try to avoid political discussion with any family other than my husband or his sister.
 
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I have friends who are pro life, but they are really pro life, as in caring for children after they are born, and they put their money and their time into helping those less fortunate than they are. I can and do respect that.

So, I think that, for me, it's the entire package, rather than individual issues taken separately, that matters. Is the person someone who lives life with integrity and compassion? That's what matters, ultimately.

And that's where certain things are dealbreakers, as far as I'm concerned - bigotry; being irresponsible toward those in your care, whether human or nonhuman; generally lacking compassion for those in need; hypocrisy.

I don't ever again want to live with a human who eats meat, but that's not a qualifier for my friendship, as long as the person understands and respects my choice in that regard. OTOH, I cannot be friends with someone who treats their companion animal(s) irresponsibly or callously. I guess I make allowances for the former because meat eating is so deeply ingrained in our culture, and God knows, my eyes stayed firmly closed for more than thirty years.

ETA: I am extremely fortunate in that my sister and I have practically identical values - that has been, and continues to be, a great comfort in my life.